Space and the universe... [interests, sightings and events]

[JEDIpartner]

Just thought this would be a cool thread. Not sure who's on board with the realities of space aside from the fantastic aspects of it... like Star Wars.

I was inspired to start this thread 'cos I just came in from outside after seeing the International Space Station fly over northern Ohio. The coolest thing was that trailing behind it was the space shuttle! I wasn't expecting to see the shuttle as the news reports only mentioned the ISS. Apparently you could see the Shuttle closer to the ISS on Tuesday evening. I was glad to have this opportunity since I missed it the other night.

I remember seeing Skylab at the end of June many years ago. A couple weeks after that, I was visiting my family in Japan when Skylab came down in the ocean west of Australia. That was really eventful for the young me who was, possibly starting High School that year.

Anyhow... I'd like to see this thread used for these types of events or news stories that might interest like-minded people!

[LusiferSam]

I'm totally down with this thread. I've always loved astronomy and space related stuff. I guess that's why I'm study it to be a professional astrophysicist. I'll keep people informed if there is a cool high energy photo of the week or other high energy astrophysics topics that I know about.

[Rocketboy]

I'm a casual astronomy fan, so I'll read/post here.
I know Cappy is pretty into astronomy, so he'll probably show up in this thread.

[TeeEye7]

Great thread!

I, too, saw the International Space Station with the Shuttle last night. Quite the sight!

I have the additional luck that Edwards Air Force Base is tucked in the southeast corner of my county. Unfortunately, I work nights and didn't have the opportunity to drive the short hour it takes to get there to see Atlantis touch down today, since I've got to go to work tonight (I kinda like to get my sleep! :sleeping:).

I did get to see Challenger make the first-ever shuttle night landing way back when. I had a press pass and exclusive access since my wife was a news reporter back then. I was able to attent the astronauts' press conference with her. It was weird to think that just a few minutes prior, the crew I was looking at had been in space, flying around at 17,500 mph, and they were acting as if they had just gotten off a United flight or something.

Great thread JP! I look forward to everyone's contributions! :thumbsup:

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Walking back to my house from the library yesterday, I heard a 'boom-boom' sound, remembered the shuttle was landing at its alternate site at Edwards AFB, checked my watch (12:46pm PST), and kept walking. I live too far south (and having a range of mountains blocking clear sight) to actually see the craft, but it was still cool.

Going to the SW exhibit at the California Science Center was cool, not just to see the costumes and props from the films. It was great to see how they matched the scientific discoveries to the special effects and plot devices from the movies.

One thing I have missed has been "science jokes." While waiting in line to get into Griffith Observatory a few months back (post-renovation but pre-fire), I got to make some "humorous" (always a relative term with we fellow geeks :D ) comments about Pluto's demotion to "minor planet" (BBBOOOOOO!!!!! :upset: ), gravity's effects, etc. Not to say that my family isn't smart, but there's a difference between a conversation with those who know more and those who don't, that's all (not that I know a lot, of course... :rolleyes: ). There's more to the story about waiting in the line, too (not the smartest people running it, ironic considering the brilliance on display at the musuem itself :yes: ).

[Ji'dai]

I was watching CNN report on the Shuttle landing yesterday. I knew it was expensive to ferry the craft to Florida if it lands in CA, but they estimated it costs about $1.7 million to transport the thing.

During landing, it takes about six minutes for the shuttle to cover the distance between California and Florida - wow, that's fast!

---

I remember seeing Comet Hyakutake just about every day for a week when it passed near Earth several years ago. I'd get up and run before dawn and the comet was by far the brightest object in the morning sky. Cool sight to see.

I live out in the country, a good distance from city lights, so I have a unobstructed view of the night sky. At certain times of year, I can occassionally see the Aurora Borealis on clear nights; which was nice surprise when I first saw it. I always thought the Northern Lights were just an Arctic Circle phenom.

[JEDIpartner]

I'm glad that people are finally contributing to this thread! :) I was a little disappointed when it just sat there and sunk.

One of the highlights in my life was taking a group of friends from university to the Dayton Observatory to see Comet Halley in the winter of 1985-86. It was fantastic to see all those people up on the hill with their telescopes and getting to see something that hadn't come around to our part of the solar system in ages!

[stillakid]

I hate space. We should fill it up with garbage from our landfills. :mad:

[Bel-Cam Jos]

I was watching CNN report on the Shuttle landing yesterday. I knew it was expensive to ferry the craft to Florida if it lands in CA, but they estimated it costs about $1.7 million to transport the thing.

During landing, it takes about six minutes for the shuttle to cover the distance between California and Florida - wow, that's fast!

---

I live out in the country, a good distance from city lights, so I have a unobstructed view of the night sky. At certain times of year, I can occassionally see the Aurora Borealis on clear nights; which was nice surprise when I first saw it. I always thought the Northern Lights were just an Arctic Circle phenom.Then just drop in 6 minutes worth of fuel and fly 'er back home, NASA! And they say they're so smart... :rolleyes:

I am jealous of those who have little light polution near them. I have to drive somewhere else just to see the gigantic night sky? Wha-?!? Huh?!? :confused: I plan to see the Northern Lights sometime; maybe I'll have to just keep on driving someday... :D

[TeeEye7]

Back before all you kiddies were born, I attended a lecture by Arthur C. Clarke at Jet Propulsion Lab (we lived in Glendale, CA at the time). 2001: A Space Odessey had just come out and Clarke's lecture foretold a lot of what is reality today. Even though I was in my early teens, I was riveted to his words. It's more meaningful now as now there's talk of a base on the moon, and the push to explore Mars. We'll see just how much of ol' Art's predictions do come true!

[JEDIpartner]

Well, this was an interesting article!! I have always been fascinated with the Tunguska blast from the early part of the 20th Century and the mystery surrounding it. Granted, there have been some far-flung ideas of it being a crashed spacecraft, but there have also been theories of it being a piece of comet or even a meteor. I ran across this on my Yahoo page today!


Crater Could Solve 1908 Tunguska Meteor Mystery

Dave Mosher (dmosher@imaginova.com)
Staff Writer
SPACE.com (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/byline/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=10m6rt8b7/*http://www.space.com) Tue Jun 26, 6:46 AM ET

In late June of 1908, a fireball exploded above the remote Russian forests of Tunguska, Siberia, flattening more than 800 square miles of trees. Researchers think a meteor was responsible for the devastation, but neither its fragments nor any impact craters have been discovered.

Astronomers have been left to guess whether the object was an asteroid or a comet, and figuring out what it was would allow better modeling of potential future calamities.

Italian researchers now think they've found a smoking gun: The 164-foot-deep Lake Cheko (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=16mv7mlth/*http://www.space.com/php/multimedia/imagedisplay/img_display.php?pic=070626_lake_cheko_02.jpg&cap=Lake+Cheko%2C+in+the+Siberian+region+of+Tungus ka.+Credit%3A+www-th.bo.infn.it%2Ftunguska+%2F+University+of+Bologna ), located just 5 miles northwest of the epicenter of destruction.

"When we looked at the bottom of the lake, we measured seismic waves reflecting off of something (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=19t038ba0/*http://www.space.com/php/multimedia/imagedisplay/img_display.php?pic=070626_cheko_seismic_02.jpg&cap=I+seismic+%22reflection%22+beneath+Lake+Cheko. +Researchers+think+a+core+sample+will+reveal+evide nce+of+a+meteorite%2C+which+may+cause+the+reflecti on.+Credit%3A+www-th.bo.infn.it%2Ftunguska+%2F+University+of+Bologna )," said Giuseppe Longo, a physicist at the University of Bologna in Italy and co-author of the study. "Nobody has found this before. We can only explain that and the shape (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=1a6ibkmq2/*http://www.space.com/php/multimedia/imagedisplay/img_display.php?pic=070626_cheko_sonar2_02.jpg&cap=A+three-dimensional+rendering+of+Lake+Cheko+in+Tunguska%2C +Siberia.+The+level+of+the+lake+is+lowered+40+mete rs+%28131+feet%29+to+emphasize+its+cone-like+shape.+Credit%3A+www-th.bo.infn.it%2Ftunguska+%2F+University+of+Bologna ) of the lake as a low-velocity impact crater."

Should the team turn up conclusive evidence of an asteroid or comet on a later expedition, when they obtain a deeper core sample beneath the lake (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=19j4neco2/*http://www.space.com/php/multimedia/imagedisplay/img_display.php?pic=070626_cheko_sonar1_02.jpg&cap=A+3-D+sonar+image+showing+Lake+Cheko%27s+funnel+shape+ hidden+beneath+its+waters.+Researchers+believe+it% 27s+indicative+of+a+meteoric+impact.+Credit%3A+www-th.bo.infn.it%2Ftunguska+%2F+University+of+Bologna ), remaining mysteries surrounding the Tunguska event may be solved.
The findings are detailed in this month's online version of the journal Terra Nova.


Submerged evidence
During a 1999 expedition, Longo's team didn't plan to investigate Lake Cheko as an impact crater, but rather to look for meteoroid dust (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=1244560uh/*http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/asteroid_breakup_030716.html) in its submerged sediments. While sonar-scanning the lake's topography, they were struck by its cone-like features.

"Expeditions in the 1960s concluded the lake was not an impact crater, but their technologies were limited," Longo said. With the advent of better sonar and computer technologies, he explained, the lake took shape.
Going a step further, Longo's team dove to the bottom and took 6-foot core samples, revealing fresh mud-like sediment on top of "chaotic deposits" beneath. Still, Longo explained the samples are inconclusive of a meteorite impact.

"To really find out if this is an impact crater (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=12ei7p4fd/*http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/planetearth/asteroid_jello_001122.html)," Long said, "we need a core sample 10 meters (33 feet) into the bottom" in order to investigate a spot where the team detected a "reflecting" anomaly with their seismic instruments. They think this could be where the ground was compacted by an impact or where part of the meteorite itself lays: The object, if found, could be more than 30 feet in diameter and weigh almost 1,700 tons-the weight of about 42 fully-loaded semi-trailers.


Caution for now
From a UFO crash (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=1222fk2jv/*http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/tunguska_event_040812.html) to a wandering black hole, wild (and wildly unsupported) explanations for the Tunguska event have been proposed. Alan Harris, a planetary scientist at the Space Science Institute in Boulder, Colorado, said the proposal by Longo's team isn't one of them.

"I was impressed by their work and I don't think it's something you can wave off," said Harris, who was not involved in the research.
Longo and his team "are among the recognized authorities on Tunguska" in the world, Harris told SPACE.com (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=10igrb90a/*http://SPACE.com). "It would be thrilling to dig up chunks of the meteor body, if they can manage to. It would lay the question to rest whether or not Tunguska was a comet or asteroid."

Some researchers, however, are less confident in the team's conclusions.
"We know from the entry physics that the largest and most energetic objects penetrate deepest," said David Morrison (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=12i8ti0l9/*http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/astronomy/morrison_interview_020702-1.html), an astronomer with NASA's Ames Research Center. That only a fragment of the main explosion (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=12gktev6u/*http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/planetearth/tunguska_mystery_011031.html) reached the ground and made a relatively small crater, without creating a larger main crater, seems contradictory to Morrison.

Harris agreed that physics could work against Longo's explanation, but did note that similar events-with impact craters-have been documented all over the world.

"In 1947, the Russian Sikhote-Alin meteorite created 100 small craters (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/space/sc_space/storytext/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery/23522009/SIG=122qh2vu5/*http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/mystery_monday_040301.html). Some were 20 meters (66 feet) across," Harris said. A site in Poland also exists, he explained, where a large meteor exploded and created a series of small lakes. "If the fragment was traveling slowly enough, there's actually a good chance (Longo's team) will unearth some meteorite material," Harris said.

Longo's team plans to return to Lake Cheko next summer, close to the 100th anniversary of the Tunguska Event. "This is important work because we can make better conclusions about how cosmic bodies impact the Earth, and what they're made of," Longo said. "And it could help us find ways to protect our planet from future impacts of this kind."
SOURCE (http://news.yahoo.com/s/space/20070626/sc_space/cratercouldsolve1908tunguskameteormystery)

[LusiferSam]

My one problem with the debate on where the Tunguska event was caused by a comet or an asteroid is that we really don't know that much about either. Comets can look a lot like asteroids if they have run out of gas or have turned off. And asteroids can look like comets if they start venting gas. I personally think NASA's explanation is the best right now. A C class asteroid came in over Tunguska and exploded leaving little to no remnants. C class asteroid are very likely comets that have turned off.

Quick note on names. Meteoroids are small chucks of rock in space. Meteor is an event where a small space rock enters the Earth atmosphere and burns up leaving a bright, but brief fiery trail. And a meteorite a piece of rock from space that survived it's trip through the atmosphere and landed on Earth.

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Quick note on names. Meteoroids are small chucks of rock in space. Meteor is an event where a small space rock enters the Earth atmosphere and burns up leaving a bright, but brief fiery trail. And a meteorite a piece of rock from space that survived it's trip through the atmosphere and landed on Earth.And a meteorette is a rock with a little pink bow on top. :D

I earned my Boy Scout astronomy merit badge (many have said it's one of the hardest to get) when I went to a camping trip to Catalina Island. That was great, seeing the stars without city lights. I've also been to a few star parties over the years, but sady I seem to be unable to identify celestial objects well.

[LusiferSam]

I saw a huge meteor last night. I was at a friend's for a little party and we were watching other people's fireworks when I saw this. It must have traveled a fourth of the way across the sky, was twice the size of a pencil eraser held at arms length, lasted a good 5 or 6 seconds and you could see it brake up. It was easily the brightest one I've ever seen.

[TeeEye7]

I saw a huge meteor last night. I was at a friend's for a little party and we were watching other people's fireworks when I saw this. It must have traveled a fourth of the way across the sky, was twice the size of a pencil eraser held at arms length, lasted a good 5 or 6 seconds and you could see it brake up. It was easily the brightest one I've ever seen.

I've worked the graveyard shift for 13 years and counting now. Seeing celestial displays like that is one of the benefits of being a night creature. It is soooo cool watching meteors! I've seen colors ranging from pure white, to yellow, to green. And just like LS says, they can get really bright. I've seen one so bright that it actually cast our shadows on the ground! :cool:

[JEDIpartner]

Here's a fascinating article about how scientists are contemplating terra-forming the Martian surface to produce oxygen for the atmosphere!


Can trees grow on Mars?
Scientists seek an answer by studying forests on a Mexican volcano

MEXICO CITY - Scientists are using the pine-forested slopes of a Mexican volcano as a test bed to see if trees could grow on a heated-up Mars, part of a vision of making the chilly and barren red planet habitable for humans one day.

Planetary scientists at NASA and Mexican universities believe if they can warm Mars using heat-trapping gases, raise the air pressure and start photosynthesis, they could create an atmosphere that would support oxygen-breathing life forms.

Getting trees growing would be a crucial step. The scientists' quest has taken them to the snow-capped Pico de Orizaba — a dormant volcano and Mexico's tallest mountain — to examine trees growing at a higher altitude than anywhere else on Earth.

"It sounds like science fiction, but we think it's feasible," said research professor Rafael Navarro-Gonzalez, who has spent nine years examining Pico de Orizaba's pine forests.

"We have experienced warming our planet with greenhouse gases, but on Mars we could do it faster with more powerful gases," he said in his lab at Mexico City's UNAM university.

The first human mission to Mars is seen 10 to 15 years away, and the warming-up process could start 50 years later, NASA scientist Chris McKay said. There will also be ethical issues to overcome.

"It's playing gardener more than playing God, but the ethical questions are important," McKay said.

By pumping in highly insulating gases like methane or nitrous oxide, the scientists think they could heat Mars to 41 degrees Fahrenheit from minus 67 F now. That would match temperatures where trees grow at 13,780 feet on Pico de Orizaba.

Having trees on Mars, as opposed to only simple plant forms like algae or lichens, would open the possibility of humans one day being able to breathe Martian air.

The scientists are studying what makes trees refuse to grow above a certain point, where temperatures drop and the air becomes thinner, to see how easily they could grow on Mars.

"Things don't really start cooking from a biological point of view until trees start growing. Trees are the engines of the biosphere," McKay said.

"It's possible Mars could have trees in 100 years. (But first) we need to understand what sets the tree line on Earth," McKay said by telephone from NASA's Ames center in California.

No calls to earthlings
Despite Mars' lifeless rocky surface, burning ultra-violet radiation and its extremely thin, carbon dioxide-loaded air, humans have for long been obsessed with finding life there.

Scientists believe Mars has ice at its polar caps that could melt into seas and that its subsoil contains the key elements needed for life.

Even though none will live to see the fruit of their work, the scientists on the Pico de Orizaba project believe it would be fairly straightforward to pump greenhouse gases into Mars' atmosphere, introduce bacteria to start photosynthesis and finally send up tree seeds with a human mission.

"Nothing that we know rules it out. There's still a lot of uncertainty, but nothing that's a showstopper," McKay said.

The project would be called off if life was found to already exist on Mars.

"The idea is to explore the possibility of colonizing Mars. If there is life, we have no right to destroy it. But if Mars is barren we could take life from Earth to Mars," said Navarro-Gonzalez, spinning a Mars globe that shows ravines 6 miles deep and dizzying 10 mile high mountains.

His "before" and "after" images show the arid planet transformed into a new world of lush green plains, lakes and mineral-rich mountains that could one day supply earth.

Still, that vision is centuries away. For now, anyone braving the six-month flight to Mars would have to live in a pressurized dome, suffer violent dust storms and be cut off from earthlings too far away to easily speak to.

In the long term, Mars's low gravity could also have odd effects on would-be settlers, causing people to grow alarmingly tall, and cosmic radiation could cause cancers and mutations.

McKay ruled out anything more permanent than short-term research bases for the next century. "I don't have this vision of people moving to Mars the way people settled the New World, setting up homes and bringing their families."

[Rocketboy]

Sure, its getting harder and harder finding ways to screw up our planet so lets f*ck with the next one over.

[JEDIpartner]

Ahem. If you don't wish to participate in a constructive way...

[Rocketboy]

I guess I should elaborate...
Its f*cking retarded to attempt something this asinine and far-fetched on a complete and total waste of time. Far too much money would be wasted when it could be spent on something worthwhile and useful.

[LusiferSam]

All right, I really like this week's High Energy Astrophysics Picture of the Week (http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/objects/heapow/heapow.html). It's a Chandra image of a supernova remnant. While it's not the best image (which makes me think it's a short observation) it's still pretty cool. Other good Chandra images of SNR's are Cas A (http://chandra.harvard.edu/photo/2006/casa/index.html) (a source I worked on for a couple of years), The Crab (http://chandra.harvard.edu/photo/2002/0052/index.html), and Tycho's (http://chandra.harvard.edu/photo/2005/tycho/index.html).

[JEDIpartner]

I guess I should elaborate...
Its f*cking retarded to attempt something this asinine and far-fetched on a complete and total waste of time. Far too much money would be wasted when it could be spent on something worthwhile and useful.

The thing is, ceturies from now, we may rely on this study for something. You never know.

All right, I really like this week's High Energy Astrophysics Picture of the Week (http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/objects/heapow/heapow.html). It's a Chandra image of a supernova remnant. While it's the best image (which makes me think it's a short observation) it's still pretty cool. Other good Chandra images of SNR's are Cas A (http://chandra.harvard.edu/photo/2006/casa/index.html) (a source I worked on for a couple of years), The Crab (http://chandra.harvard.edu/photo/2002/0052/index.html), and Tycho's (http://chandra.harvard.edu/photo/2005/tycho/index.html).

Those are amazing images!!!! Thanks for sharing those!

[pbarnard]

This week or is it next weeks Nature is having an article on new IR Spectroscopic method for detecting water in gas giants with close orbits to stars. Small preview in their podcast.

[TeeEye7]

....man walked on the moon!

C'mon, kiddies, are we so blasé about it that we don't even recognize the event? I thought this would have been mentioned sooner than this! What a shame! :sad:

[darthvyn]

most of us weren't born when it happened, so it wouldn't be something we remember to remember, akin to JFK's assassination or pearl harbor. certain generations will remember it to the day they die, but those generations that didn't witness it first-hand have no frame of reference as to the importance of the event, and thus it doesn't stick in our minds. it's hard to believe right now, but there will eventually be a generation that doesn't even pause for a bit of reflection on september 11th. such is life.

and then, of course, there's those of us that remember it as the day they filmed people walking in the nevada desert with a high-speed camera. ;)

[Bel-Cam Jos]

....man walked on the moon!

C'mon, kiddies, are we so blasé about it that we don't even recognize the event? I thought this would have been mentioned sooner that this! What a shame! :sad:I had planned to wait until July 20th to do so. I even wrote a poem about this significant world event a few years back. I've always loved space and science, so this was one of the first important dates I ever memorized.

I recently saw a clear night sky (in Ohio) for the first time in perhaps a decade. Living in southern CA, that's about as rare as a Hollywood waiter who's NOT an actor.

[darthvyn]

I had planned to wait until July 20th to do so.

um... today is july 20th.

[Bel-Cam Jos]

um... today is july 20th.Um... so I did post about it; TeeEye7 just beat me to it. I guess that makes me like the USSR, then. :loser: ;)

[TeeEye7]

most of us weren't born when it happened, so it wouldn't be something we remember to remember, akin to JFK's assassination or pearl harbor. certain generations will remember it to the day they die, but those generations that didn't witness it first-hand have no frame of reference as to the importance of the event, and thus it doesn't stick in our minds. it's hard to believe right now, but there will eventually be a generation that doesn't even pause for a bit of reflection on september 11th. such is life.

Point very well taken. Being an old f@rt around here, you lose sight of the time and experience factor sometimes that exists here. This was one of the most monumental events I've witnessed in my lifetime: akin to watching Columbus step on shore of the New World. It will always stick in my mind. Too bad others don't have the positive experience of the moon landing, but do have the unfortunate memories of 9/11. Well written, darthvyn. :thumbsup:

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Being an old f@rt around here, you lose sight of the time and experience factor sometimes that exists here. ... It will always stick in my mind. Too bad others don't have the positive experience of the moon landing, but do have the unfortunate memories of 9/11. Well written, darthvyn. :thumbsup:I wasn't around then, but I still consider it a monumental occurence. But that comes from my love of space. I'm planning on reading the new Neil Armstrong biography soon.

[stillakid]

....man walked on the moon!

C'mon, kiddies, are we so blasé about it that we don't even recognize the event? I thought this would have been mentioned sooner than this! What a shame! :sad:

It was more monumental than most people can comprehend. I think that perhaps it has a bit to do with our entertainment of late, showing us distant worlds, albeit fictional, that manage to be flashier than our own boring orbiting ball of dust.

For myself, I was just a couple of months old so significant events in history wouldn't start to resonate with me for quite some time. Even now, it is difficult to recognize the most important events that will have historical significance until the dust has cleared, sometimes literally.

I even wonder sometimes that if we are ever blessed with visitors from another world, how our current culture would welcome them if they don't live up to our "exciting" expectations set up by popular media.

[JEDIpartner]

I have a vague recollection of the moon landing. I remember being on the floor of our apartment in Richmond Heights, Ohio and laying underneath the coffee table with a blanket. :)

[TeeEye7]

Bad stuff, kiddies. A friend of mine here at work has friends who work at Scaled Composites. We still don't know identities of the victims. Scaled is big stuff here in the county....

http://video.knbc.com/player/?id=134487

(sorry for the ad prior to the video)

[pbarnard]

Came across http://www.shatters.net/celestia/index.html Celestia, an open source program that allows you to view the various stars, planets, etc. It also allows for modification to insert your own fictional stuff, or whatever you want. Heard about it while watching NCIS, and just searched for it thinking it was fictional, but it is real.

[Bel-Cam Jos]

The lunar eclipse was cool the other night; it's been a loooooong time since I've seen one here on the west coast.

[LusiferSam]

Here's a short article on adaptive optics (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6975961.stm) I enjoyed because of the images. It doesn't say much about how it's really done, but oh well. Another good reason to mention it is because of some of the early work done in this field was a major of Reagan's Star Wars program. The US DOD flipped out when astronomers starting do the same research and publishing it. Any way, enjoy the photos.

[TeeEye7]

Very cool and interesting stuff! Thanks for sending it along, LS!
I'm still amazed at how far we've come optically. I grew up seeing fuzzy images of Mars and being able to make out the polar ice caps and thought that was cool at the time! :crazed:

[TeeEye7]

I was out on a death investigation last night in the Mojave desert. In spite of it all, it was a beautiful, clear night! A gazillion stars with the Milky Way easily seen, as was Mars. A nice little splash of light from an asteroid, too! Such a spectacular sight I wish I could see every night, but living in a city of about 400,000, all those city lights makes it impossible. :(

[TeeEye7]

http://www.space.com/news/071003-ap-asteroid-takei.html

Kind of a cool honor, IMO.

[TeeEye7]

Saw the International Space Station being followed by Space Shuttle Discovery (about 10 minutes later) beginning around 7:30 tonight before going to work. It's always cool to see! :thumbsup:

[stillakid]

Saw the International Space Station being followed by Space Shuttle Discovery (about 10 minutes later) beginning around 7:30 tonight before going to work. It's always cool to see! :thumbsup:

With a telescope? How clear are they when looking through one?

[TeeEye7]

With a telescope? How clear are they when looking through one?

Nope, just bare-naked eye. What you see looks like a fast-moving star. I don't have anything optically that could get a better view of something 200 miles above me (tho I wish I did!). The Space Station is quite a bit brighter than the Shuttle. I guess size matters ;)!

Thankfully, we have a better-than-average TV weather guy who's really into space stuff. He always lets the viewers know of events like the above. He's given us "heads-ups" on meteor showers, the occaisional comet, and even idirum flares (reflection for the solar panels of iridium communications satellites...a cheap thrill, granted, but still cool to track and watch happen).

If it weren't for the smoke, the shuttle/space station would have been easily visible in the Valley last night.

[LusiferSam]

Anyone else been watching Comet Holmes? About a week ago the normally dim comet jumped in brightness and is now visible to the naked eye. There's no tail, but a nice fuzzy ball of a star like object in Perseus.

[TeeEye7]

I wish I could. We're entering our notorious fog season here in the San Joaquin Valley. Days and nights are consistently hazy now with moisture and plain old junk in the air. Hearing about its "overnight" leap in brightness makes it just that much more frustrating!

BTW: In my post above I've misspelled iridium. I hate it when my fingers stutter! ;)

[El Chuxter]

Iridium: good for astronauts, bad for dinosaurs.

[BountyHunterScum]

In the past ten years I have had two shooting stars fly over my head. One a few months ago at night I thought it was a helicopter at first until I noticed it was smoking and moving way too fast to be man made. The other at dawn while waiting for the school bus.

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Last couple of nights/mornings have had my favorite common dark time sight: what I call the paper slit moon. It's where the moon is exactly bisected along its diameter in the waxing/waning cycle. I always thought that someone/something had a full-circle moon and could slide it through a slit in the night sky on those times. Simple, but thoughtful... awwww... :rolleyes:

[TeeEye7]

As I said above: Sky viewing is problematic this time of year due to fog.

Yesterday there was a 100 car pile-up with two fatalities due to fog, just south of Fresno on Hwy. 99, a major N-S corridor in here central California.

We get to deal with this until February. Oh, joy! :rolleyes:

[JEDIpartner]

Here's an interesting article that came up on my Yahoo homepage this morning!


http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20071030/capt.cd4fe59b2395447c909444a0643f7f14.comet_holmes _txsl101.jpg?x=380&y=237&sig=jAPWOnqiW7SehlDlM4YkKQ--
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071103/ap_on_sc/brighter_comet

Comet draws scientific, amateur interest

Sat Nov 3, 12:57 AM ET
KNOXVILLE, Tenn. - A comet that has unexpectedly brightened in the past couple of weeks and now is visible to the naked eye is attracting professional and amateur interest.

Paul Lewis, director of astronomy outreach at the University of Tennessee, is drawing students to the roof of Nielsen Physics Building for special viewings of Comet 17P/Holmes.

The comet is exploding and its coma, a cloud of gas and dust illuminated by the sun, has grown to be bigger than the planet Jupiter. The comet lacks the tail usually associated with such celestial bodies but can be seen in the northern sky, in the constellation Perseus, as a fuzzy spot of light about as bright as the stars in the Big Dipper.

"This is truly a celestial surprise," Lewis said. "Absolutely amazing."

Until Oct. 23, the comet had been visible to modern astronomers only with a telescope, but that night it suddenly erupted and expanded.

A similar burst in 1892 led to the comet's discovery by Edwin Holmes.
"This is a once-in-a-lifetime event to witness, along the lines of when Comet Shoemaker-Levy 9 smashed into Jupiter back in 1994," Lewis said.

Scientists speculate the comet has exploded because there are sinkholes in its nucleus, giving it a honeycomb-like structure. The collapse exposed comet ice to the sun, which transformed the ice into gas.

"What comets do when they are near the sun is very unpredictable," Lewis said. "We expect to see a coma cloud and a tail, but this is more like an explosion, and we are seeing the bubble of gas and dust as it expands away from the center of the blast."

Experts aren't sure how long the comet's show will last, but estimate it could be weeks — if not months. Using a telescope or binoculars help bring the comet's details into view, they said.

[LusiferSam]

I guess Comet Holmes is now growing tail. APOD claims there is now a blue ion tail. I'm not sure if it's visible to the naked eye or not. It's been to cloudy here the last two nights for me to go out and look. Today has cleared off nicely, so I might break out the telescope tonight and have a look at the thing.

[JEDIpartner]

Here's an interesting article I spotted on my homepage about a geological formation on Mercury.


Probe detects "spider" crater on Mercury
By Will Dunham
Wed Jan 30, 4:28 PM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A NASA probe that shot past Mercury this month detected a puzzling geological feature that scientists on Wednesday labeled "The Spider" and found evidence of past volcanic activity on the closest planet to the sun.

The U.S. space agency's car-sized MESSENGER spacecraft on January 14 flew past Mercury, whose diameter is just a third the size of Earth's, and its seven scientific instruments gathered new information about the little understood planet.

Data collected by MESSENGER showed that a massive impact crater on its surface is larger than previously thought. The probe is due to fly by again this October and in September 2009 before beginning a yearlong orbit of the planet in 2011.

While Mercury looks superficially like Earth's moon with a cratered, rocky surface, scientists said the new findings show they are quite different.
"We were continually surprised. It was not the planet we expected. It was not the moon," said Sean Solomon of Carnegie Institution of Washington, the mission's lead investigator. "It's a very dynamic planet with an awful lot going on."

Mercury is a mystery in many ways and its proximity to the sun has made it difficult to observe from Earth.

Mercury has been visited by a spacecraft only twice before, in 1974 and 1975 when NASA's Mariner 10 flew past it three times and mapped about 45 percent of its surface. The latest fly-by covered another 30 percent of the surface.

"The Spider" was the most striking feature described by the scientists. It is made up of more than 100 narrow, flat-floored troughs radiating from a central point, much as petals from a daisy or the legs of a spider.

"A REAL MYSTERY"
"The Spider" has a crater 25 miles wide near its center, but it is unclear whether this is related to the feature's original formation and scientists aren't sure what to make of it.

"It's a real mystery," said Louise Prockter of Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory in Laurel, Maryland, who works on the mission.
"The Spider" is in the middle of Mercury's Caloris basin, one of the solar system's biggest impact craters, formed more than 3.8 billion years ago when a large space rock hit.

Based on the probe's new observations, the diameter of the Caloris basin is now thought to be 960 miles, larger than a previous estimate based on Mariner 10's data. The basin's interior looks like it was volcanically resurfaced by magma from deep within Mercury's crust or mantle.

Prockter said Mariner 10 data provided some evidence of volcanism, but it was not universally accepted. Based on the new observations, Prockter added, "there's very little doubt, I think, in the minds of most of us from the geology team that there has been widespread volcanism on Mercury's surface."

MESSENGER stands for Mercury Surface, Space Environment, Geochemistry and Ranging. It was launched in 2004 and flew past Venus twice and Earth once en route to Mercury.

MESSENGER also collected data on Mercury's magnetic field, its tenuous atmosphere and its topography.

Mercury's surface is a mix of craters caused by bygone impacts with space rocks, plains and long, winding cliffs. The spacecraft saw basins as deep as 1.7 miles and peaks jutting out as high as 3 miles above the surface.
With Pluto classified as a dwarf planet, Mercury is the solar system's smallest planet, with a diameter of 3,032 miles , only a bit larger than Earth's moon.

[Ji'dai]

Not surprising that there is evidence of past volcanic activity on Mercury given the planet's proximity to the most massive object in the solar system. The sun's tidal forces probably keep Mercury's interior churning. Jupiter causes similar events on its moons, especially Io.

---

Did you guys see the Martian rock (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=509693&in_page_id=1770) that looks like a person with arms outstretched? The photo was taken by the NASA Spirit explorer and was widely reported on cable news channels last week.

[TeeEye7]

I dunno why, but when I saw that image, it reminded me of this......( the Little Mermaid in Copenhagen harbor).

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Simple one; when I wake in the morning, right as I open my front door I've seen the two planets next to each other, staring right back at me. I heard its Venus and Mercury, I think. Only a few more days left, before it's gone for several years!

[TeeEye7]

Yes! I've been greeted with that sight every morning, too, BCJ! It is indeed Mercury and Venus. Seems our little planet appears to be in some sort of alignment with them these days. When I look to the sky, I'm hoping to see a big, black monolith float into the alignment, too.....:cool:

[JEDIpartner]

Did you guys see the Martian rock (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=509693&in_page_id=1770) that looks like a person with arms outstretched? The photo was taken by the NASA Spirit explorer and was widely reported on cable news channels last week.

I thought it was a funny picture 'cos it looked like the "figure" pushed another one off the rock and the other one was laying unconscious on the ground!!! :laugh:

Simple one; when I wake in the morning, right as I open my front door I've seen the two planets next to each other, staring right back at me. I heard its Venus and Mercury, I think. Only a few more days left, before it's gone for several years!

I think it's really romantic (and not in a lovey dovey kinda way) to look up at the sky and see these celestial bodies up there and think about the passing of time and how fortunate we are to see and appreciate these occurrences.

[LusiferSam]

Not surprising that there is evidence of past volcanic activity on Mercury given the planet's proximity to the most massive object in the solar system. The sun's tidal forces probably keep Mercury's interior churning. Jupiter causes similar events on its moons, especially Io.

Tidal forces really aren't at play with Mercury, at least as far as volcanism goes. Io is in the middle of three way tug-of-war between Jupiter, Europa, and Ganymede. Venus and the Earth (the closest bodies to Mercury) as simply too far away for such interaction. I think comparison to Ganymede is more fair. Mars, Venus, and the Moon all show evidence of past volcanism. I think anytime you have a liquid core in a rocky planetary body over a geological time scales you'll see volcanism. My guess is the minor planets will also show evidence of past volcanic activity.

Now that's not to say at tidal forces aren't affecting Mercury. The planet has a global magnetic field. It's thought it's generated in a similar manner to the Earth's. Something must be keeping Mercury's core soft. Tidal interactions are the simplest explanation. If Venus were closer or more massive you might see a planet like Io. So the core is soft enough to keep the B-field, but not enough for active volcanoes. Like Ganymede.

[Jargo]

i actually managed to see sky today. briefly. then the clouds covered it again.

[JEDIpartner]

i actually managed to see sky today. briefly. then the clouds covered it again.

Life in the UK, then?

[Jargo]

yeah. *sigh* never see diddly here.

[El Chuxter]

You probably never see Diddley because he's too old to tour nowadays. The dude's 80 and recently had a stroke.

[JEDIpartner]

The letters in Bo's first name? B.O. - you stink, man!! LOL

[TeeEye7]

I wonder if the cantina crowd thought the same thing about Mr. Shek? I bet his flight suit was gamey after a long flight.....:ermm:

[Jargo]

i'm so glad i'm intoxicated right now chux and find that funny as i reply. that has got to be one of the lamest jokes ever lol

[Rocketboy]

Total Lunar Eclipse tonight mofos. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23184927/?GT1=10856)

[TeeEye7]

Total Lunar Eclipse tonight mofos. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23184927/?GT1=10856)

We had cloudy skies last night, but we had enough breaks in the cover to enjoy the sight! I've seen several lunar eclipses in my life, and they never get old! My eight-year-old niece and five-year-old nephew (who are living with us for the meantime) especially enjoyed it. It was the first time they ever experienced the event.

Thanks for letting us know, RB! :thumbsup:

[Rocketboy]

And naturally, since I posted it, I missed 75% of it. I thought of it about 9pm and was going to wait until 10:20ish to see the peak. I next looked at the clock at 11:30pm.
:frus:

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Mars has another lander! And it's still red. The planet, not the machine.

[JEDIpartner]

Did they form any conclusions on the nature of the light coloured surface underneath the lander? Is it ice?

I wonder if the cantina crowd thought the same thing about Mr. Shek? I bet his flight suit was gamey after a long flight.....:ermm:

Don't most astronauts who stay in their flight suits for long haul have to pee in them? Yeah-- I'm just sayin'. :ermm:

[CaptainSolo1138]

I watched the ISS in transit the other night. A pretty cool sight!

[Blue2th]

Mars has another lander! And it's still red. The planet, not the machine.
I hope they find some kinda life, and it's not transformers. :)

Though I heard recently they were having a communication malfunction.

[TeeEye7]

I watched the ISS in transit the other night. A pretty cool sight!

It is a cool sight! Twice, now, I've seen the ISS and Shuttle chasing/following it when it's brought new supplies and crew. Very cool! (Not to mention very fast, too!).

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Though I heard recently they were having a communication malfunction.A communications malfunction can only mean one thing: Martian invasion. :alien:

[CaptainSolo1138]

It is a cool sight! Twice, now, I've seen the ISS and Shuttle chasing/following it when it's brought new supplies and crew. Very cool! (Not to mention very fast, too!).
I saw it Sunday night, and Monday was supposed to be even brighter due to the shuttle being docked. But, go figure, it was cloudy the next few nights.

[TeeEye7]

For my fellow SoCal-ers:

The Space Shuttle will be visible tonight, traveling from the north to the southeast around 8:20pm to 8:25pm, plus or minus. It will be about 36 degrees above the horizon. I would recommend going out about 10 minutes earlier than that to get your eyeballs acclimated to the dusk.

I live about 100 miles north of LA....so from JT to Tycho....the rest of SoCal should be able to see it, too. Just look for the bright, fast-moving "star" in the sky!

[Bel-Cam Jos]

For my fellow SoCal-ers:

The Space Shuttle will be visible tonight, traveling from the north to the southeast around 8:20pm to 8:25pm, plus or minus. It will be about 36 degrees above the horizon. I would recommend going out about 10 minutes earlier than that to get your eyeballs acclimated to the dusk.

I live about 100 miles north of LA....so from JT to Tycho....the rest of SoCal should be able to see it, too. Just look for the bright, fast-moving "star" in the sky!Do we get a refund for the plague of light pollution 'round here? :upset: I'll try and remember it; I will be outdoors as a human guard/ticket taker at my HS's graduation ceremony at the school football stadium, and it should still going on by then.

[TeeEye7]

Again for our menagerie of So Cal-ers:

The Shuttle will again be visible in the southwestern skies this time, from 8:43pm to 8:49pm tonight (June 10) in my area; and depending on atmospheric conditions in your area.

:alien:

[TeeEye7]

Well.....even though they're really bad, here's some shaky, blurry clicks of the International Space Station and Space Shuttle (the thin little squiggly line) with the moon (the fat blob) as a bonus as it went by last night over my little town.

It's a hand-held effort, and a tripod would have done little, too. Anyway, it's always cool to see my tax dollar whizzing overhead at 17,500 miles per hour!

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Sorry. In my duties as ticket taker/ripper in half, I forgot to look up, as I was dealing with such gems as those below:

"What do you mean I can't get on the field?"
"This is f***ing stupid."
"I came all the way from [some far away location] and I can't get in without a ticket?"
"Can't you let me in?"
"I just want to take a picture."
"This is bulls***."
"If I offer you 20 cents, would you open the gate?" [this was an actual question to me, but was in jest]
"No, those are south side tickets; this is the north side."
"Any extra tickets?"

I'll try to remember to head outside tonight, tonight.

[TeeEye7]

Unfortunately, it's trajectory won't take it over our area tonight.

Re: graduation.....your clientèle sounded like prime subjects for Force Lightning! :twisted:

[Bel-Cam Jos]

All I did yesterday was confuse my neighbors by looking up at the sky over an hour or so. And enjoy the coolness of a day that was hot and an evening that was quite comfortable. Thanks for feeding me false science/technology information, TI, and allowing me to relax and enjoy nature instead. :D

And, no, I think the "can have an effect on the weakminded" line is better than Force lightning. In polite manners, I did the "move along, move along" thing (wait, does that make me the weak one? :eek: ) throughout the line.

[JEDIpartner]

Did you guys read that the new classification of Pluto and similar smaller planetoids is called a "plutoid" now? Oh, dear maker... what is WRONG with these people anymore???!!

[JEDIpartner]

Well.....even though they're really bad, here's some shaky, blurry clicks of the International Space Station and Space Shuttle (the thin little squiggly line) with the moon (the fat blob) as a bonus as it went by last night over my little town.

It's a hand-held effort, and a tripod would have done little, too. Anyway, it's always cool to see my tax dollar whizzing overhead at 17,500 miles per hour!

Great picture!!!

[El Chuxter]

I'm just glad to see in that same article that the ridiculous decision to downgrade Pluto from a planet is still rather controversial among astronomers.

I still say it was never anything more than a publicity stunt, and a stupid one at that.

[TeeEye7]

Thanks for feeding me false science/technology information, TI....

:confused: I give everyone a "heads-up" on the two nights the ISS/STS will orbit over our area, and that's bad info.....? HUH?! :confused:

[Bel-Cam Jos]

For my fellow SoCal-ers:

The Space Shuttle will be visible tonight, traveling from the north to the southeast around 8:20pm to 8:25pm, plus or minus. It will be about 36 degrees above the horizon. I would recommend going out about 10 minutes earlier than that to get your eyeballs acclimated to the dusk. You will definitely see it, even if you go out too early or too late or miss my information and just "guess" at where and when to look. It will be the greatest time of your life, even better than that time in Jamaica on the sailboat with that one person (you know what I'm talking about). View this scientific wonder and you will gain 12 pounds of lean muscle, become a better dancer, and recall every hockey statistic from 1954-1987. This, I command!

I live about 100 miles north of LA....so from JT to Tycho....the rest of SoCal should be able to see it, too. Just look for the bright, fast-moving "star" in the sky!Uh, I copied this word-for-word from your post on May 32, 2008, TI. So if it's listed this way above, as they say on the Intraweb, it must be true. :D I can't dance good, am flabby 'round the middle/edges/top/bottom, and don't know much aboot hockey from those years. :rolleyes:

[TeeEye7]

Geez, I writes sweller than I thought! :D

[Blue2th]

So there is an Earth 2 and 3 and 4.... Astronomers find batch of "super-Earths"



WASHINGTON — European researchers said on Monday they discovered a batch of three "super-Earths" orbiting a nearby star, and two other solar systems with small planets as well.

They said their findings, presented at a conference in France, suggest that Earth-like planets may be very common.

"Does every single star harbor planets and, if yes, how many?" asked Michel Mayor of Switzerland's Geneva Observatory. "We may not yet know the answer but we are making huge progress towards it," Mayor said in a statement.

The trio of planets orbit a star slightly less massive than our Sun, 42 light-years away towards the southern Doradus and Pictor constellations. A light-year is the distance light can travel in one year at a speed of 186,000 miles a second, or about 6 trillion miles.

The planets are bigger than Earth -- one is 4.2 times the mass, one is 6.7 times and the third is 9.4 times.

They orbit their star at extremely rapid speeds -- one whizzing around in just four days, compared with Earth's 365 days, one taking 10 days and the slowest taking 20 days.

Mayor and colleagues used the High Accuracy Radial velocity Planet Searcher or HARPS, a telescope at La Silla observatory in Chile, to find the planets.

More than 270 so-called exoplanets have been found. Most are giants, resembling Jupiter or Saturn. Smaller planets closer to the size of Earth are far more difficult to spot.

None can be imaged directly at such distances but can be spotted indirectly using radio waves or, in the case of HARPS, spectrographic measurements. As a planet orbits, it makes the star wobble very slightly and this can be measured.

"With the advent of much more precise instruments such as the HARPS spectrograph ... we can now discover smaller planets, with masses between 2 and 10 times the Earth's mass," said Stephane Udry, who also worked on the study.

The team also said they found a planet 7.5 times the mass of Earth orbiting the star HD 181433 in 9.5 days. This star also has a Jupiter-like planet that orbits every three years.

Another solar system has a planet 22 times the mass of Earth, orbiting every four days, and a Saturn-like planet with a 3-year period.

"Clearly these planets are only the tip of the iceberg," said Mayor.

"The analysis of all the stars studied with HARPS shows that about one third of all solar-like stars have either super-Earth or Neptune-like planets with orbital periods shorter than 50 days."

[Blue2th]

Double post (so sue me)
So this is why the Martians had to leave:
Scientists think big impact caused two-faced Mars

This artists rendition released by Jeffery Andrews-Hanna of Massachusetts In...
1 hour ago
29 Recommendations
LOS ANGELES — Why is Mars two-faced? Scientists say fresh evidence supports the theory that a monster impact punched the red planet, leaving behind perhaps the largest gash on any heavenly body in the solar system.

Today, the Martian surface has a split personality. The southern hemisphere of Mars is pockmarked and filled with ancient rugged highlands. By contrast, the northern hemisphere is smoother and covered by low-lying plains.

Three papers in Thursday's journal Nature provide the most convincing evidence yet that an outside force was responsible.

According to the researchers, an asteroid or comet whacked a young Mars some 4 billion years ago, blasting away much of its northern crust and creating a giant hole over 40 percent of the surface.

New calculations reveal the crater known as the Borealis basin measures 5,300 miles across and 6,600 miles long — the size of Asia, Europe and Australia combined. It's believed to be four times bigger than the current titleholder, the South Pole-Aitken basin on Earth's moon.

Astronomers have long puzzled over Mars' landscape ever since images beamed back in the 1970s showed different-looking halves. An orbiting spacecraft later observed the northern lowlands were on average 2 miles lower than the southern highlands and had a thinner crust.

Scientists who had no role in the studies said the latest research strengthens the case for a colossal Martian impact, but it does not rule out the other theory that hot rock from inside the planet could have welled up and formed the different crusts.

"The betting odds have gone up a lot in favor of the impact model," said Walter Kiefer, a staff scientist at the Lunar and Planetary Institute in Houston.

The idea of an ancient impact was first advanced by Steve Squyres of Cornell University and Don Wilhelms of the U.S. Geological Survey in the 1980s. Squyres, currently the lead scientist for the twin Mars rovers, had always hoped other scientists would "pick that ball up and run with it."

"It wasn't a totally nutty idea that there could have been an impact," Squyres said.

But finding evidence of one proved difficult because part of the basin rim is now covered by a bulging volcanic range.

For one study, a team of scientists from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory recreated what the Martian surface would have looked like before the volcanoes formed using gravity and surface measurements from spacecraft. They determined the impact basin is oval-shaped, similar to what would be expected if a space object had hit at an angle.

"The shape is really one of the key pieces of evidence that it was probably formed in a giant impact," said MIT postdoctoral researcher Jeffrey Andrews-Hanna, whose original "gut feeling" favored the other theory.

A separate group led by the California Institute of Technology developed 3-D simulations to determine the "sweet spot" of conditions that would form the basin.

According to their calculations, a 1,000-mile-wide object traveling at more than 13,000 miles per hour — or 24 times faster than a jetliner — would hit Mars at an angle between 30 and 60 degrees. The collision would be equal to an explosion of 75 trillion to 150 trillion megatons of TNT.

In the third study, a team of researchers led by the University of California, Santa Cruz, found that shock waves from such an impact would disrupt the southern crust.

All three teams believe there was a single giant blow and not several small hits because there's no evidence of other basins.

___

[TeeEye7]

Has anyone been watching the When We Left Earth, The NASA Missions series on Discovery Channel? This thing is several notches past awesome! I've already dropped not very subtle hints about the DVD for Christmas already.

If you haven't tuned in, I'd highly recommend it!

[jedi master sal]

Total Eclipse this morning!

[sith_killer_99]

The martian surface was created after the last great war between old earth Atlantis and the Martian invaders. The Martians lost!

Also, I do not believe in the existence of intelligent life in the universe...anywhere!

[TeeEye7]

Also, I do not believe in the existence of intelligent life in the universe...anywhere!

Well! I guess you just told me off! ;)

[TeeEye7]

This just in:

It's the Perseids meteor shower show tonight, kiddies! Actually Aug. 12 at about 3am until sunrise. Look to the northeast for the most part. Up to 100 meteors per hour.

Viewing won't be the best because of the moon's phase right now....too dang bright! So for all you graveyard shift workers or insomniacs: have fun!

If you miss it this year, set your calendar for next, as this is an annual event courtesy of the Maker.

I guess I should state this is US west coast info.

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Woo-hoo! More cool night sky viewing that I probably won't be able to see! :rolleyes: (but I'll try... set an alarm or something)

[CaptainSolo1138]

I made it a point to sit outside for a while last night for longer than the duration of a cigarette and was able to see one meteor shooting from NE to SW. I was actually surprised to have seen that considering my neighborhood is well lit and it was only about 11:00pm.

[TeeEye7]

Very cool! There should be a little residual happenings tonight, too, but not near what it should have been last night. I was on a case (I see dead people...again) last Friday night/Saturday morning and there were some good displays.

He's a little wiki on the Perseids:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perseids

Also, if you're a moonaholic like me, I just found out about this site:

http://www.mondatlas.de/index_e.html

Check out the images!

[Blue2th]

They finally tested the Supercollider. So much for creating a Black Hole. Though they haven't put it at full power yet.


GENEVA — The world's largest particle collider passed its first major tests by firing two beams of protons in opposite directions around a 17-mile (27-kilometer) underground ring Wednesday in what scientists hope is the next great step to understanding the makeup of the universe.

After a series of trial runs, two white dots flashed on a computer screen at 10:26 a.m. (0826 GMT) indicating that the protons had traveled clockwise along the full length of the 4 billion Swiss franc (US$3.8 billion) Large Hadron Collider — described as the biggest physics experiment in history.

"There it is," project leader Lyn Evans said when the beam completed its lap.

Champagne corks popped in labs as far away as Chicago, where contributing and competing scientists watched the proceedings by satellite.

Five hours later, scientists successfully fired a beam counterclockwise.

Physicists around the world now have much greater power to smash the components of atoms together in attempts to learn about their structure.

"Well done, everybody," said Robert Aymar, director-general of the European Organization for Nuclear Research, to cheers from the assembled scientists in the collider's control room at the Swiss-French border.

The organization, known by its French acronym CERN, began firing the protons — a type of subatomic particle — around the tunnel in stages less than an hour earlier, with the first beam injection at 9:35 a.m. (0735 GMT).

Eventually two beams will be fired at the same time in opposite directions with the aim of recreating conditions a split second after the big bang, which scientists theorize was the massive explosion that created the universe.

"My first thought was relief," said Evans, who has been working on the project since its inception in 1984. "This is a machine of enormous complexity. Things can go wrong at any time. But this morning has been a great start."

He didn't want to set a date, but said that he expected scientists would be able to conduct collisions for their experiments "within a few months."

The collider is designed to push the proton beam close to the speed of light, whizzing 11,000 times a second around the tunnel.

Scientists hope to eventually send two beams of protons through two tubes about the width of fire hoses, speeding through a vacuum that is colder and emptier than outer space. The paths of these beams will cross, and a few protons will collide. The collider's two largest detectors — essentially huge digital cameras weighing thousands of tons — are capable of taking millions of snapshots a second.

The CERN experiments could reveal more about "dark matter," antimatter and possibly hidden dimensions of space and time. It could also find evidence of the hypothetical particle — the Higgs boson — which is sometimes called the "God particle" because it is believed to give mass to all other particles, and thus to matter that makes up the universe.

The supercooled magnets that guide the proton beam heated slightly in the morning's first test, leading to a pause to recool them before trying the opposite direction.

The start of the collider came over the objections of some who feared the collision of protons could eventually imperil the Earth by creating micro-black holes, subatomic versions of collapsed stars whose gravity is so strong they can suck in planets and other stars.

"It's nonsense," said James Gillies, chief spokesman for CERN.

CERN was backed by leading scientists like Britain's Stephen Hawking , who declared the experiments to be absolutely safe.

Gillies told the AP that the most dangerous thing that could happen would be if a beam at full power were to go out of control, and that would only damage the accelerator itself and burrow into the rock around the tunnel.

Nothing of the sort occurred Wednesday, though the accelerator is still probably a year away from full power.

The project organized by the 20 European member nations of CERN has attracted researchers from 80 nations. Some 1,200 are from the United States, an observer country that contributed US$531 million. Japan, another observer, also is a major contributor.

Some scientists have been waiting for 20 years to use the LHC.

The complexity of manufacturing it required groundbreaking advances in the use of supercooled, superconducting equipment. The 2001 start and 2005 completion dates were pushed back by two years each, and the cost of the construction was 25 percent higher than originally budgeted in 1996, Luciano Maiani, who was CERN director-general at the time, told The Associated Press.

Maiani and the other three living former directors-general attended the launch Wednesday.

Smaller colliders have been used for decades to study the makeup of the atom. Less than 100 years ago scientists thought protons and neutrons were the smallest components of an atom's nucleus, but in stages since then experiments have shown they were made of still smaller quarks and gluons and that there were other forces and particles.

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[LusiferSam]

They finally tested the Supercollider. So much for creating a Black Hole. Though they haven't put it at full power yet.

The idea that the LHC would create a Earth killing black hole is very silly. For one thing cosmic rays hitting the upper atmosphere with energies well above anything that will happen at CERN, Fermilab, or any other collider site. So that fact that planet killing subatomic events don't happen in nature, which are more energetic and more frequent than any thing we humans can do, should end the argument.

[Ji'dai]

Uh-uh. Just wait until the Mist rolls up on your front lawn. Then you'll wish they hadn't been smashing those atoms over there.

[2-1B]

Yeah, I hope Stephen Hawking isn't wrong about that...

What if things go haywire and we all suddenly

[TeeEye7]

What if things go haywire and we all suddenly

Do you mean as if millions of voices cried out in terror, and then were suddenly silenced? :shocked:

[pbarnard]

I myself not so worried about the black hole creation. I'm worried about is what happens if they actually do create the proper conditions for a big bang and all of the suden, gravity becomes repulsive for just a femptosecond. Will it just tear up the Alps, or will we all be ripped apart? ;)

[Blue2th]

If they can harness that gravity repulse then we'll be driving around in landspeeders.

[2-1B]

As repulsive as a certain forum member's mom ? :confused:

[LusiferSam]

To help put your fears to rest about the LHC, here's a web site for you. Has the Large Hadron Collider destroyed the world yet? (http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/) I hope this helps.

[El Chuxter]

Actually, we're all in the afterlife because the world was destroyed. We just don't know it yet, because we were all bad, and hell is posting on a Star Wars collecting forum filled with unfunny Slicker's Mom jokes for all eternity.

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Or perhaps we're in Bizarro World, where such jokes are hilarious elsewhere (elusive). I just want my Iron Man repulsor gauntlets. :pleased:

[TeeEye7]

Good evening space fans:

For us West Coasters (as in US of A), tonight (Sept. 19), look to the north at 7:34pm at about a 45 degree angle above the horizon and you will witness an iridium flare.

Not only that, but the International Space Station will be zooming over us in a W to NE track around 8pm.

Always cool stuff! As they say in New Orleans: "Don't fail to miss it!"

[Bel-Cam Jos]

Good evening space fans:

For us West Coasters (as in US of A), tonight (Sept. 19), look to the north at 7:34pm at about a 45 degree angle above the horizon and you will witness an iridium flare.

Not only that, but the International Space Station will be zooming over us in a W to NE track around 8pm.

Always cool stuff! As they say in New Orleans: "Don't fail to miss it!"What would happen if we all farted in that general direction at that same time?

[TeeEye7]

What would happen if we all farted in that general direction at that same time?

I dunno. What?

[Old Fossil]

What would happen if we all farted in that general direction at that same time?

What do you mean, "we all?"

[Bel-Cam Jos]

What do you mean, "we all?"
we = collective pronoun, in first person, i.e. oneself including at least one other
all = including everyone or everything
I dunno. What?
Well, an open flame, sophomoric games involving bodily emissions, a semi-subtle reference to a British-style comedy film, spoken in a poor French accent. Clearer now? :rolleyes:

BTW, I completely forgot about this and was indoors at the time. I saw nothing, NOTHING! :sad:

[LusiferSam]

I think he might to have say "What would happen if all of us farted in that general direction at that same time?" But I could be wrong, I'm not real fluent in Southern.

Ok all joking aside, I've really been in enjoying Jupiter for the past couple of weeks (on clear nights of course). It's about dead south in Sagittarius just after sunset and is the brights thing in the sky at that point. Now I find this to be great. Sagittarius is one of those constellations I have trouble identifying. This despite the fact that I seem to date girls who are Sagittarius and feel like an idiot when I can't point it sky in the night sky.

And now for something completely different. NASA has a new Gamma-Ray observatory, Fermi Gamma-Ray Space Telescope (formally known as GLAST, Gamma-Ray Large Area Space Telescope). Late last month NASA released this picture of the Gamma-Ray sky (http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/objects/heapow/archive/large_scale_structure/allsky_lat.html). As I really like high energy astrophysics, I thought I should share.