Matrix Reloaded Discussion [Archive] - SirStevesGuide.com Forums

Patient Zero

04-10-2003, 05:26 PM

Incase anyone likes (or knows) Juno Reactor, I got this from the www.metropolis-records.com website.

> Juno Reactor: Caught in the Matrix
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Philadelphia, PA, April 4

Juno Reactor recently took time off from recording their next album to score scenes for the upcoming Matrix 2: Reloaded movie to be released in theatres this May.

Juno Reactor was initially invited out to Los Angeles by the directors to provide music on one of the films key scenes, a 20 minute freeway chase.

The scene was described by Newsweek:

"The climax of Reloaded is a lengthy freeway chase that, like the original Matrix in 1999, will redefine action filmmaking and visual effects for years. The sequence may be the most audaciously conceived, thrillingly executed car chase ever filmed."

After completing this scene the directors were so impressed they asked Juno Reactor to work on a further three scenes, therefore, providing more music than any other artist. In total, three new Juno Reactor tracks ("Teahouse," "Mona Lisa Overdrive/Dante," and Juno Reactor vs. Don Davis "Burley Brawl"), as well as the classic track "Komit" will appear in the movie. These tracks feature the signature electronic sounds of Juno combined with orchestration by Ben Watkins and the film's score composer Don Davis.

The Matrix 2: Reloaded movie, however, isn’t the only part of the franchise that Juno Reactor will take part in. Three Juno Reactor tracks will appear on the two CD soundtrack for the summer blockbuster: "Mona Lisa Overdrive," "Teahouse," and "Burley Brawl." The soundtrack will also contain trailers for the film, the animated companion (Animatrix), and the video game (Enter the Matrix).

Three of the Animatrix trailers will contain Juno Reactor favorites: "Conga Fury," "Guardian Angel," and "Masters of the Universe." While, the Enter the Matrix video game will include all four of the Juno Reactor tracks found on the Matrix 2: Reloaded soundtrack, plus "Badimo" and "Masters of the Universe."

Once Upon a Time in Mexico, the upcoming sequel to El Mariachi and Desperado starring Antonio Banderas, Johnny Depp, and Salma Hayek, will utilize Juno Reactor’s song "Pistolero" in trailers, and as well as the title track for the film.

Not many bands can claim they can cross many musical boundaries with the ease that Juno Reactor has. Trance, techno, industrial, pop, rock, dance, and world - Juno Reactor has touched them all. Their latest release, Odyssey 1992-2002, is a celebration of their on-going achievements. Featuring the best of the best Juno Reactor tracks from all of their albums, as well as a brand new track, this digi-pac is sure to please fans and newcomers alike. It's Juno Reactor doing what they do best - pushing the music in new directions and constantly challenging the concept of what an electronic based band should be and sound.

Deoxyribonucleic

04-10-2003, 06:15 PM

there's a nice short movie or long trailer, which ever you prefer to call it, of the animatrix running in selected movies. I really enjoyed it.

http://www.intothematrix.com/

187-Maul

04-13-2003, 10:23 AM

the new trailer looks so awesome, I just watched it today for the first time (the 96 mb version) and it blew me away, I can't wait to see this movie in may (and get the figs from mcfarlane:D )

The 'Xir

04-14-2003, 05:39 PM

I'm sure this will get moved to the "other' section under Tv's and movies, but I thought it deserved the attention of a more visited thread!

HAVE YOU SEEN THE NEW MATRIX (thematrix.com) TRAILER? OH MY GOD I CAN'T WAIT!!!!

I Think I have to admit this series is the Star Wars for the 2000's
only a month away!!!

The 'Xir

04-14-2003, 05:41 PM

sorry the link should work now!

Jedi_Master_Guyute

04-14-2003, 06:08 PM

Yeah, this link was posted in the Matrix thread in the movie forum last week :)

Yeah, it's a great trailer indeed. :D

Eternal Padawan

04-14-2003, 09:19 PM

Has anyone seen the short 8 minute movie before Dreamcatcher?
The Final Flight of the Osiris? It was made by the same chaps who did the Final Fantasy movie and sets up the upcoming Matrix sequels. it will also be released on the upcoming anime collection Animatrix DVD in a few weeks.

I haven't seen it, but I heard it is too cool for school....

Mandalorian Candidat

04-15-2003, 12:57 PM

Is anyone else disturbed by the two butt-white dreadlock twins from the trailer? Odd, very odd...

Prince Xizor

04-20-2003, 03:02 PM

My friends and I just preordered our Matrix Reloaded tickets, all 25 of them. First day, for the 6:30 showing.
We have been known to do this sort of thing for the really big fantasy sci-fi movies, Episodes I & II, Fellowship & Two Towers. We all wait in line for about 3 or 4 hours depending on the movie (I think it was 8 for Clones), and basically use up the whole back row.

Has anybody else bought Matrix tickets yet, and do anybody else get together with a ton of friends for big movies like this?

Pendo

04-20-2003, 03:10 PM

Don't think tickets are for sale for them here yet. I know Matrix is going to be big but I don't think there will be a need for me to book my tickets, my local Showcase Cinema is hardly ever packed, it wasn't even full when TPM and AOTC was released. I may order them the day before, but that's about it.

Xizor, do you get 25 of your friends to go with you, or do you sell your tickets when the showing is sold out :p?

PENDO!

Prince Xizor

04-20-2003, 08:32 PM

I ususally get all my friends to go with, but sometimes one or two of them backs out at the last sec, so I scalp those tickets in line for twice the price!:)

Jayspawn

04-20-2003, 11:52 PM

The next Martix movie is definatly going to be big, but theres no need to preorder tickets. I'll just get them opening day when I see the movie.

QLD

04-20-2003, 11:58 PM

You know, I never understand why people always want to sit in the back of the theater.

In my opinion, the best seats are usually 5-10 rows back.

Pendo

04-21-2003, 07:42 AM

Originally posted by Lando In My Pants
You know, I never understand why people always want to sit in the back of the theater.

In my opinion, the best seats are usually 5-10 rows back.

I agree, somewhere where you don't have to look up at the screen, or look down, and in the very centre of the row - the best view possible :).

PENDO!

Prince Xizor

04-21-2003, 03:27 PM

The arm rests go up in the back of my theater.

And I don't have to worry about some moron kickin my seat.

RooJay

04-22-2003, 01:58 AM

I don't need tickets - I get in for free.;) :happy: :evil:

Kidhuman

04-22-2003, 09:42 AM

I didn't like the first one so no to the question at hand.

RooJay

04-23-2003, 09:37 PM

Weirdo!:p

Kidding!;) :D

Patient Zero

04-24-2003, 10:34 AM

I waited in line several hours to get tickets for Ep1 & 2 and it was a waste of time as I could have just gone the day of the show and still gotten them. So no. I will be going opening weekend, but I won't put myself out about it by waiting in line.

I am actually more excited about this then AOTC. I mean, a movie based on two of my favorite philosophical viewpoints: Taoism and Jungian psychology. I'll be there, but I just hope that I haven't built it up to much in my head like some 'other' movies. :;):

Sentinel18725

04-24-2003, 11:19 AM

I think we are going to see it when we are traveling for a college "reunion". I hope we get to go to Wehrenberg theaters. The popcorn is better.

James Boba Fettfield

05-05-2003, 12:42 AM

Forum users JarJarBinks shared this link with me to two early reviews of Reloaded. Review (http://www.hometheaterforum.com/sneak/matrix.html)

Again, thanks to JarJarBinks for the link to this page, and I felt you guys might want to read this.

Pendo

05-05-2003, 05:42 AM

3 and 3.5 out of 5. I don't think the movie is as good as everyone's expecting :(. I've seen some pretty mixed reviews around the net, I'll try and dig up some links.

PENDO!

jjreason

05-07-2003, 08:03 PM

Im pretty jazzed up about it, and getting more that way as the movie approaches. Im going in totally spoiler free, so that's nice for a change. The white twins ARE really scary looking, Rob Zombie meets Biker Scout meets the hockey players from Strange Brew. Nothing calming there.

James Boba Fettfield

05-14-2003, 11:23 AM

10:00pm-SOLD OUT (I'll be there)
10:00pm-SOLD OUT
10:45pm-SOLD OUT
10:45pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
11:30pm-SOLD OUT
12:15am-SOLD OUT
12:15am-SOLD OUT
12:15am-SOLD OUT
12:15am-SOLD OUT
12:15am-SOLD OUT
12:15am-SOLD OUT
12:15am
12:15am
12:15am
12:59am

That's what is happening tonight at my local 24 screen AMC. 21 shows already sold out for a Rated R movie. I expect those last 4 to sell out before tonight. This movie is going to be very, very big.

scruffziller

05-14-2003, 11:59 AM

I have been hearing that it isn't all that spectacular, then again I have been listening to movie goer idiots.

Hasbro'sBountyHunter

05-14-2003, 01:57 PM

I'll be going to the DC premere of the Matrix Reloaded tonight at 7PM at the Warner Theater. Just a few more hours for me! :D

Jedi_Master_Guyute

05-14-2003, 02:27 PM

JBFF- ah, the sweet sweet Lennox on OSU campus. I remember when all their theaters had the Two Towers playing @midnight and after. All of them sold out and i was lucky enough to be there. Ah, let me have a moment of silence for the man who was first in our line, who was dressed up like a soldier and Gondor, and had a bellowing horn which he blew so many times i wanted to stab in his eyes. :zzz:

Anyway, got my tickets for the 10:02 pm showing at Nelsonville Movies 10 just North of Athens. Very very giddy, i must say.
Screw any mixed reviews; sci-fi movies are generally frowned upon anyway. This movie is for the fans and the fans it will please. :D

Hasbro'sBountyHunter

05-14-2003, 10:53 PM

Just got back from watching the DC premere of The Matrix Reloaded! Here's a word of advice (no it's not a spoiler), stay for the credits 'cause they'll show the trailer to the Matrix Revolutions.

James Boba Fettfield

05-15-2003, 01:50 AM

You shouldn't have said that, that's how my friend and I were separating the nerds from the casual movie goers. Ha, wow...I won't say anything about the movie. Pay attention when they're talking though, my friend looked away for a second, and I had to explain a lot of what was said to him. My only negative concern with the movie was that whole Zion celebration thing. What was that, Stomp meets the club scene with some bodies getting too close for comfort. Okay, I sleep now.

darthvyn

05-15-2003, 02:17 AM

holy crap, this movie rocked!

Jedi_Master_Guyute

05-15-2003, 02:19 AM

I agree. This movie was crazy nuts!! The fight scenes had me amazed the entire time. Some spots of dry and long dialogue, but i guess it's necessary. Rock on!! :D

icatch9

05-15-2003, 09:42 AM

I'm with you guys, the party sceen was way to long. I also hate to say it, but the gratuitus sex sceen was way to long too. I mean I like Trinady naked and all, but come on lets get back to the story and the action.

I didn't stay for the trailer, it was late enough as it was. Probally see it again this weekend at a normal time and wait for the end.

Cool cool movie. As it's been said a bit slow in some parts (the whole begggining (minus the opening sceens w/ Trenady). What was the point to the whole back story on LinK? Talk about cutting room floor. Oh well, awsome movie. I see it more and more like an Alice in Wounderland story than ever befor.

Porcelina

05-15-2003, 10:22 AM

for those who have seen the movie, a quick question.... what did you think of the special effects?? i've heard there not as good as the original movie, more "cartoonish" looking.... true or not? they seemed kinda crappy in the preview i saw.....

icatch9

05-15-2003, 10:41 AM

Well, they are "cartoonish". I'm glad I'm not the only one who things so. They are amazing, but you can totaly tell when they use it. It is so hard to re-creat human movement, skin tone, and texture of clothing.

The whole time he's fighting with the 1,000's of Mr. Smiths it looks like looney toons. As I said it's incredible, but at the same time no better than any other CG character. Worse on some levels becasue most other CG characters are aliens in wich we don't really know what they look like. We know what Neo looks like, so when he's CG you can tell becasue we see so much of Keanue. Again, the whole thing is cool but you can totaly tell.

As I said after the movie last night "I don't see it winning the Oscar for Speical Effects". I'll stand by that statement until Oscar night.

James Boba Fettfield

05-15-2003, 10:52 AM

Yeah, you can tell during that Burly Brawl (Smith/Neo fight) that the actors aren't real, but seriously, how else would you create a cool fight like that. I feel the effects were adequate enough to get the point across with the fight. I didn't consider it Looney Tunes level of animation, but it got the idea across, think Blade 2 fight effects.

You really can't compare the effects in question to the first movie, since the first one never really needed to do the level of human cgi that this movie did.

icatch9

05-15-2003, 11:22 AM

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to insinuate that the CGI was as bad as a cartoon from the 40's. I was just trying to say cartoon again with saying "cartoon". My bay :D.

I agree that it was needed becasue it's not as if there are that many people that look like Hugo Weaving :D. I'm not trying to knock the film at all, I was just reporting what I saw.

Can't wait to hear all the bashing when the Hulk come out, and that was done by the Masters (ILM). Oh well movie goers are never happy :D.

James Boba Fettfield

05-15-2003, 11:28 AM

Ha ha, I'm not worried about the Hulk. Whether it looks a little cartoony or not, no big deal to me. Like in Blade 2, you could tell it wasn't Snipes fighting in some scenes, but I felt the message of the kind of things Blade could do was conveyed accurately, so I could forgive the less than perfect cgi.

icatch9

05-15-2003, 12:00 PM

Yea, that's a good point. Part of the cool fighting sceens are all about what a character can do. It shouldn't be so important that it looks 100% real, it looks real enough. Still some people are never happy and actually expect it to look like better. I say if ILM can't make the Hulk look real than no one can. They are after all the tops of the CGI game.

Pendo

05-15-2003, 12:21 PM

Originally posted by icatch9
Yea, that's a good point. Part of the cool fighting sceens are all about what a character can do. It shouldn't be so important that it looks 100% real, it looks real enough.

One of the things I loved about the effects of the 1st movie was the actual actors were performing most of the stunts. When you see Neo or Trinity flying in the air in slow-mo it's like "whoa, look what they can do in the Matrix" and it's so believable, you can suspend reality and believe that the Matrix is real.
Now that it's CGI the reality of those effects/stunts are taken away, and because the actors aren't performing them it's harder to let your mind go into the world of the Matrix and believe that it's real and they can really do that.

PENDO!

icatch9

05-15-2003, 12:44 PM

Originally posted by Pendo
One of the things I loved about the effects of the 1st movie was the actual actors were performing most of the stunts. When you see Neo or Trinity flying in the air in slow-mo it's like "whoa, look what they can do in the Matrix" and it's so believable, you can suspend reality and believe that the Matrix is real.
Now that it's CGI the reality of those effects/stunts are taken away, and because the actors aren't performing them it's harder to let your mind go into the world of the Matrix and believe that it's real and they can really do that.

PENDO!

Good points. It's a differnt kind of special effects. There were plunty that the real actors did. Chato, simi, ect, but the agent smith fight really took it away for me. It was cool, but detered from the high standard that Matrix has set for itself and all other movies.

wedgeA

05-15-2003, 03:13 PM

All I can say is amazing! I think it delivered on the action level, but also on an intellectual level, as well. I loved the whole theme of free will vs. predetermination and it was played out brilliantly. It was refreshing to see a summer blockbuster that actually requires the viewer to not only think, but actually concentrate.

As for the action scenes, even though they used CGI for the martial arts sequences, I still liked them, but the incredible freeway chase looked real.

Overall, highly superior to the first film and can't wait for Revolutions.

icatch9

05-15-2003, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by wedgeA

It was refreshing to see a summer blockbuster that actually requires the viewer to not only think, but actually concentrate.

As for the action scenes, even though they used CGI for the martial arts sequences, I still liked them, but the incredible freeway chase looked real.

Overall, highly superior to the first film and can't wait for Revolutions.

Concentrate, hell I had to take notes:D. Just kidding, but it did require a lot of mind power.

YES! The freeway sceen was so very real (except when the agent jumped on the hood of the car). The whole fight sceen on the simi and the motor cycle chase was amazing.

hango fett

05-15-2003, 07:22 PM

woo! that was awsome! great CG and acting. a little hard to follow, but i managed!
h

Brainiak76

05-16-2003, 03:59 AM

yeah Reloaded was SWEET!!!!

it did make you think!! Esp when neo meet the old guy inthe chair! After about two min i wasnt really listening to that old guy!! He made my head hurt!!:D :D j/k but he was talkin awhole lotta stuff though!!

yeah some parts were a lil to cartoonish and you could totally tell! But its the matrix so i didnt expect it not to be!

I liked the twins!! i hope they have a much bigger role in revolutions!!

I wish i read this thread b4 i saw it today!! Is the trailer any good? whats in it?? I cant wait till nov!!!

lastly was neone else shocked when you saw Roy jones jr??? i was like wtf?? ah ok..:confused: :confused:

aharry

05-16-2003, 05:19 AM

I was looking up some stuff about this last film (which I enjoyed very much) when I stumbled upon this crap.

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/film/matrix50.html

I sometimes wonder if people can really grasp the concept of fiction.

James Boba Fettfield

05-16-2003, 06:53 AM

Well, that domain name for the site should be a good indicator of what to find there.

Then again, that list thing is probably just a joke.

Pendo

05-16-2003, 09:05 AM

Porcelina

05-16-2003, 11:05 AM

that article is so retarded, it made me laugh!

mostly he just rants on about how "ridiculous" and "stupid" the matrix is without justifying his argument

and when he DOES give reasons, they're either asinine or completely untrue

for example..... aaliyah DIED, so of course she was cut from the scenes... they re-cast her role to nona gaye (daughter of marvin gaye) who is also a "minority"

then when he stood in front of the movie screen and preached to the audience during the movie, he was surprised when they yelled and threw objects at him????

and he didn't know carrie-ann moss is a woman??

ah, that was too funny, though... thanks for that ;)

James Boba Fettfield

05-16-2003, 11:09 AM

Coming Soon! reports:
The dinos, webcrawlers and jedis will all be breaking a sweat when they hear the Wednesday-night preview box office figures for The Matrix Reloaded. To put it simply, the sequel smashed anything that has come before it.

Variety says the highly-anticipated sequel bowed to record grosses in late Wednesday showtimes prior to its formal opening Thursday, and first-day matinees were ringing up what executives called unprecedented numbers despite the film's R rating.

"It's become an event. The numbers I'm looking (at) on an hourly basis -- nobody has seen anything like it before," Warners distribution president Dan Fellman said. "The film is really a cultural phenomenon."

Warner Bros. won't formally report separate figures for its Wednesday night box office but instead will add those grosses into its Thursday totals, as usual.

The original Jurassic Park earned $3.1 million in first-night box office, and no film has matched that 1993 opening until now. It's believed "Reloaded" earned well more than $10 million from Wednesday night grosses alone!

The last big film to bow on a Thursday was last May's Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the Clones, which grossed $30.1 million over its first day, including night-before totals. "Clones" then dipped about 19% in its Friday grosses and went on to tally $80 million Friday through Sunday for a four-day haul of $110.1 million.

The weekend box office for "Reloaded" may be so strong that it can even surpass the Friday-Sunday opening crown from current box office champ Spider-Man in its first three days. It's possible "Reloaded" will do so much business prior to Friday that besting Sony film's historic three-day weekend performance of $114.8 million will prove just beyond reach, however.

Meanwhile, the website for the sequel has posted a huge update with behind-the-scenes photos, costume designs, storyboards and much, much more. There's also a brand new TV spot, called "Yes", which you can download here. Thanks to 'ads' for the heads up.

Woo hoo! I know box office numbers are just that and nothing more, but it's cool to hear that this great film is going to be breaking some records. Couldn't have happened to a greater series. Yes, you heard me correctly.

Jedi_Master_Guyute

05-16-2003, 11:39 AM

Huh? Cypher comes back??? Ok, apparently i missed that whole scene. Granted, the guy kinda does look like Cypher, but Cypher got capped by Tank. Speaking of which, where is Tank?!? :D

Pendo

05-16-2003, 11:55 AM

Originally posted by Jedi_Master_Guyute
Huh? Cypher comes back??? Ok, apparently i missed that whole scene. Granted, the guy kinda does look like Cypher, but Cypher got capped by Tank. Speaking of which, where is Tank?!? :D

Reading the article I thought he'd revealed a spoiler about Cypher coming back, thank God it wasn't :rolleyes: (I used the word "God", but this isn't a religious thread, please don't close it ;)).

I think Tank's actor, Marcus Chong, chose not to be in the movie cause he didn't think it would be any good. They had to replace his character in the sequels.

PENDO!

James Boba Fettfield

05-16-2003, 12:02 PM

I thought that woman who is the girlfriend to Link(?) (the new operator) made a reference to Tank And Dozer and how they gave their lives, so I'm assumming he died sometime after the first one.

Deoxyribonucleic

05-16-2003, 01:14 PM

Originally posted by aharry
I was looking up some stuff about this last film (which I enjoyed very much) when I stumbled upon this crap.

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/film/matrix50.html

I sometimes wonder if people can really grasp the concept of fiction.

Rofl, I doubt it, especially when people have to ask where the "non-fiction" section is in a bookstore??? "Um...ma'am, it's anywhere the fiction section ISN'T!!!!!" :sur: ;)

"The first film killed 13 students at Columbine High School, the disturbed trench-coated teens imitating the pipe-bombing, shotgunning film's finale. How many troubled teens are out there Reloading with the release of the sequel?"

Oh, just stop right there!!! This is ridiculous talk and while we're at it, let's give more people more ideas! Whatta MAROON this person is!!! What's worse is he's educated, ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

The Overlord Returns

05-16-2003, 01:45 PM

Umm...guys....pointless waste of time is a joke site....the dude puts ridiculous stuff like this up all the time.......

Heh...and you all fell for it.

Patient Zero

05-16-2003, 03:24 PM

Someone at work just mentioned to me that all of the cars on the highway were made by the same company. I can't remember which one though. Odd product placement.

Deoxyribonucleic

05-16-2003, 03:44 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Umm...guys....pointless waste of time is a joke site....the dude puts ridiculous stuff like this up all the time.......

Heh...and you all fell for it.

I knew that hehehe hehehhe ehheh ehe

;)

derek

05-16-2003, 03:56 PM

did any of you guys notice "cornell west" on the matrix version of their "jedi council"? for you who don't know who cornell west is, he's a "radical" african-american professor from harvard who is sometimes on political shows. :)

Brainiak76

05-16-2003, 04:37 PM

yeah i was thinking the same think bout tank! i know dozer died! but tank was still alive!!

Links girl said my brothers gave there lives for that ship or somehting like that!! But somewher along the lines of there both dead!! so i dunno!

James Boba Fettfield

05-16-2003, 04:39 PM

Jonna's got a thread at http://www.sirstevesguide.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19378 where you can discuss some deep questions (seem deep to me) and the themes this movie presents. So, if you want to do that, the thread is there for that. If you just want to say this movie rocks, well, do it in this thread.

BlahBlahBlah

05-16-2003, 06:01 PM

About the product placement of the cars:

The cars used the most were Cadillacs. I believe Trinity and Morpheus' car was an Escalade and the Twins were using the truck. I think General Motors donated a lot of cars, too.

darthvyn

05-16-2003, 07:10 PM

actually, trinity and morpheus escaped in the CTS, and binary (the twins) were driving the escalade EXT.

most of the police were driving the new chevy impala and the old chevy caprice (the agents who took over took the caprice... they know what's under that hood... ;) )

agent smith was driving an audi A8.

chevy and cadillac are both GM corporations, so, yeah, GM got a lot of their cars in this flick.

Jayspawn

05-17-2003, 01:01 AM

Well not that I've seen the movie, here's what I think...

1. Everybody in Zion loves to rave. And is hot.

2. If you didn't see the first Matrix movie or understand it, then you WON'T get this one.

3. Talk, talk, talk. The Architect, the Oracle, and the guy who had the hot girl Persophane. They talked sooo much mumbo jumbo, hell I really didn't know what they were talking about.

4. That Neo. Man, he really can do anything. Good acting by Keanu Reeves.

5. Morpheus. The 1st movie makes Morpheus to be such a great person and leader. And in "Reloaded" he's just a captain- doesn't seem like anything special. But cool none the less. Good acting by Lawrence Fishburne.

6. Where's Tank? he survived the 1st movie? Maybe he was poisioned by that shot from Cypher.

7. Whos that kid that follows Neo around? When did Neo save him?

8. The 1st movie must have been one heck of a good experience for Neo and Trinity, they hooked up fast!

9. How cool was Hugo Weaving? Very cool! That guy is just awesome!

10. The Twins were neat.

11. Best fight scene? Personally, I'd say it was between Neo and the Agent Smiths. You know what I'm talkin about.

Brainiak76

05-17-2003, 01:30 AM

7. Whos that kid that follows Neo around? When did Neo save him?

i didnt get that either..and they didnt really explain it to much...did they? haha

aharry

05-17-2003, 01:33 AM

BlahBlahBlah

05-17-2003, 10:50 AM

When Morpheus is talking to either Hamann or Lock, I forget which, he says that in the last six months, they've freed more minds than they did in six years. That tells you it's been six months since they found Neo.

In those six months, they found and freed "The Kid." He's the one that follows Neo around. He looks up to him for being the one to free him, even though Neo doesn't really want to be looked up to. He even tells the Kid "You freed yourself."

So I'm betting the Kid will have a bigger role in Revolutions. Why else would they have set him up with such a part in this movie?

vulcantouch

05-17-2003, 01:44 PM

-which is only natural i guess- he's kinda the John to neo's jesus- his herald- so takes a backseat when messiah shows up. too bad cuz he's the better actor :p

"Whos that kid that follows Neo around?"
-you didn't recognize him? that's "mouse (http://us.imdb.com/Name?Doran,%20Matt)" or "skeeter" or whatever his name was from the first movie ;)
saw it wednesday night but my hump (http://www.sirstevesguide.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=2216&perpage=15&pagenumber=1) of it ain't yet ready to post, blame that on our nice weather :D besides a pal offered to *****seat-ride me on his motobike to a 2nd showing tonight (and considering same's resonance w/highway chase, might just take him up on it :) ), so might wait till after that anyway :) meanwhile, you gonna be onboard for TEAtrix reloaded (http://www.sirstevesguide.com/forums/printthread.php?threadid=1381&perpage=920&pagenumber=2)? :)
vt

James Boba Fettfield

05-17-2003, 01:56 PM

Originally posted by vulcantouch
"Whos that kid that follows Neo around?"
-you didn't recognize him? that's "mouse (http://us.imdb.com/Name?Doran,%20Matt)" or "skeeter" or whatever his name was from the first movie ;)

Mouse is dead, remember his brick wall scene from the first film and being shot by the group of SWAT (or whatever police force they were) guys. Kid is a new character for the film.

vulcantouch

05-17-2003, 02:16 PM

well of Course i know that, i was just laughin bout how similar the two are. but now that you mention it, maybe mouskeeter's death only reinserted him back into matrix & here he is again, i.e. matrix's version of reincarnation? :crazed:

James Boba Fettfield

05-17-2003, 03:58 PM

Oh, sorry. Yeah, it's those crazy suing Metallica influences getting to me and the sense of humor. It's a joke, a joke. Yeah, your joking really did go over my head and I missed it.

scruffziller

05-17-2003, 10:26 PM

Yea I was defiantely listening to some movie going idiots. I like this one tons more than the first. This Matrix is for "smart" people. If you are just looking for nothing but saturated fights(not that there wasn't, they were killer cool) then you won't get the movie. This is for people who read Mary Shelly's Frankenstine instead of seeing the old black and white flix. People have been saying they didn't improve on the graphics.........no....they perfected them. Everything looked real the way that it would be real if that digital world existed and I mean that wholeheartedly.

NOW SPOILERS BELOW>>>

I have made a determination between myself and my friends.
How was NEO able to stop the drones at the end??????

Because THEY HAVE NEVER LEFT THE MATRIX!!!!!!!!!
Zion and everything they think is the real world is nothing but another illusion. Reference to Star Trek TNG ep SHIP IN A BOTTLE.
And if you notice that when NEO is able to see things as they are in code, did you see the difference between NEO, TRINITY, MORPHEUS, etc. and that one oriental gent that tests NEO by fighting with him. His aura is gold and not really code, but NEO and the others you see as the code. I believe our heros are nothing but programs too!!!!! So what is really going on here!!!!
A Matrix civil war, a virtual reality game gone wrong, etc. etc.!!!!!??????

Can't wait till November!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jedi_Master_Guyute

05-17-2003, 10:53 PM

*THIS IS A REPLY TO THE ABOVE POST, WHICH HAS SPOILERS*

Scruff- I like your thoughts on how Neo could stop the drones at the end. That thought also occured to me. Though, i like to think that Neo is powerful as he is in the real world, for that would just totally shake things up a bit. I also can't wait for November. :D

Brainiak76

05-17-2003, 11:31 PM

did anyone see the trailer at the end??? please describe!! i didnt know bout it!!

now spoilers.............

I thought that was weird also? how is it that int he real world he can emit an EMP??? He said its diff i can feel them! or something like that ..how? and the one asian guy that he saw in gold was weird!

mrmiller

05-17-2003, 11:33 PM

Just saw the movie today- and never read this thread before to stay away from soilers-

I thought it was great. A little cryptic, but that's one of the things that makes good science fiction. I think a lot of other movies hurt this one. So many other movies are using the "matrix effects" that everyone is are growing used to it, and the special effects doen't seem as revolutionary as they did the during the first movie (because it isn't). But they are flat out spectacular, and amazed me just as before. The "burly bawl" flat out rocked.

Maybe one reason I liked it so much was that I didn't buy into the hype, and was basically spoiler free. All I knew about the move is that the Machines were tunnling to Zion, and nothing else. So the whole story line was new for me. I thought the story was very good, just a little hard to follow, and I'm still a little confused about the ending. I can't wait to go see it again.

And it's just my luck in the quest to be spoiler free that I didn't read this forum before, and missed out on the trailer to Revelations. :(

Now for comments related to the thread
*Spoiler Alert*

I loved the rave scene- it was such a contrast to the "machine world." Showing how full of life and emotion human world is- primal even. It added some ballance to the structure of the machine world.

I think the kid is from a short in the Animatrix. He is just one of the many people Neo has helped remove from the Matrix in the last few months.

I think Dozer must have died from the wounds he suffered in the first movie. That's what it sounded like to me anyhow.

So is agent Smith now outside the Matrix?

The guy who was in gold was a renegade program- a program running in the matrix not detected by the matrix. I don't know- hey it's science fiction so anything can happen.

I'm thinking that Neo is now in the Matrix- while being in a coma. Is Neo really a Human, or a Program, or a Progamed Human, or what? He was created by the randomness of the code or whatever? I was kinda getting lost there at the end, but what I gathered was Neo was actually created from the randomness of the Matrix. Which is why he can manipulate it more than others.

You have to remember, all the people in the Matrix are really just like programs of themselves. Just simulations of how they see themselves and think their lives are. He is somewhere between the humans and the renegade programs. Ok- now my head hurts.

I can't wait untill the 3rd movie, and am going to have to see this one again to figure some stuff out.

=MATT=

James Boba Fettfield

05-17-2003, 11:41 PM

http://www.comingsoon.net/movies/m/matrix3.php
Go there and where it says this:
Trailer on Enter the Matrix Game, includes "Reloaded" spoilers!:
(must right-click and 'Save Target As' to download)
That's the trailer they showed after the movie.

darthvyn

05-18-2003, 12:04 AM

i don't think that's the exact same one... there's more with naobi than i remember, and some different voice overs... i don't know. may have to go see it again ;)

BlahBlahBlah

05-18-2003, 12:07 AM

Um... yeah, if that's the one my friend sent me, it's not the one after Reloaded.

The preview after the game starts with Ghost and Niobe talking, right? If so, then it's not the one after Reloaded.

James Boba Fettfield

05-18-2003, 12:21 AM

Oh, I stand corrected. I thought they were the same, since it seemed like when I was seeing the one in the theater it seemed to share some of the same scenes.

Ok, I just went back and watched that trailer, it's that rain scene with Smith/Neo they show that I guess fooled me into thinking they were the same.

darthvyn

05-18-2003, 12:43 AM

i think a lot of it was the same, just a few different shots, more stuff with niobe and a different voice over.

Eternal Padawan

05-18-2003, 08:03 AM

Well, I saw it.

And I was not impressed.

Oh there were some "good" parts in it, but on the whole, I felt let down by the new-age rhetoric and philosophizing by every single character in the film interspersed with marathon action sequences that seemed thrown in for the sake of it being a MATRIX movie. I was overcome with a sense of "Been there. Done that." Honestly, was anyone checking their watch after the first twenty minutes of that Neo/Million Smith March brouhaha? Then it felt like I was watching a DVD and somebody was "skipping" chapters on me towards the end. The Architect blathering away, saving Trinity, Neo stopping the sentinels "outside" the Matrix, being picked up...it was all very rushed. The Zion stuff was borrrring. And the dialogue there was the worst kind of B-movie overacting. Especially from Locke and Morpheus. And then there was the rave scene. In fighting and zealotry in a population of only 250,000? Let the machines take them then. The Wachowski Brothers said they wanted to make a good super hero movie, but in order to do so, they had to make the first Matrix movie to set it up. Now it looks as if they want to make a religious movie (a platform for cultdom? an alternative to scientology?) with all the cookie cutter confucionisms they were hurling. "There is no choice." Bleah. Oh well. At least Trinity zipping along on a cycle at 100 MPH against traffic got my heart racing. :)

I was thinking "Matrix within a Matrix" as well. The computer lets ZION "win" and "free" all the captives, so they can "rebuild" civilization, but it's all really in Matrix 7.0. They can never get out.

How did they do Oracle's scene? I thought she died before filming began? Is this some technical wizardry like that of Gladiator where they stuck Oliver Reed's head on another body? At first, they had her back to the camera and I thought "Oh. they're going to get out of it THAT way...but then she turned and spoke and I was like WHA???" That was as unsettling as anything else in the movie.

Hopefully the third film will make the second one make sense, or at least more interesting.

BlahBlahBlah

05-18-2003, 10:29 AM

The playground scenes with Gloria Foster were filmed before she died.

mrmiller

05-18-2003, 11:08 AM

But EP, that's what makes good science fiction. It has to make you think a little, and not just be a fantasy action movie.

I really need to see it again to try and figure it out better. Many of the things I thought I understood, I'm now confused about after reading everone elses interputation here on the fourms.... Thanks guys! :frus:

=MATT=

keith koth

05-18-2003, 01:55 PM

A matrix within a matrix. I also thought the same thing. The second matrix (the one that contains Zion) could possibly be the fail-safe defense program designed due to the anticipation of the mathmatical anomaly (a.k.a. the chosen one...a.k.a. Neo). Makes perfect sense that if the creator of the matrix knew that there was a mathmatical posibility of an anomaly, then he would have designed a matrix w/in a matrix.

Why didn't Neo kill the "Creator" when he was in that room?

Will Neo and the crew obtain their true freedom at the end of "Revolutions" or will we get an ending like...Neo wakes up in front of his computer with a message on the screen telling him to "follow the white rabbit"...."knock, knock".....

JON9000

05-19-2003, 11:39 AM

Originally posted by Eternal Padawan
Wachowski Brothers said they wanted to make a good super hero movie, but in order to do so, they had to make the first Matrix movie to set it up. Now it looks as if they want to make a religious movie (a platform for cultdom? an alternative to scientology?) with all the cookie cutter confucionisms they were hurling. "There is no choice." Bleah. Oh well. At least Trinity zipping along on a cycle at 100 MPH against traffic got my heart racing. :)

Well- yeah! Of course it is a religious film, with names like Morpheus, Trinity, Nebuchadnezzer, Neo as a messiah, the Merovingian, the Architect (for all you freemasons)... was there ever any doubt that this would be a religious film?

EP, you say the action scenes were all been there, done that, but when the film tried to ask deeper questions about what it means to be human and the difference between believing in fate and free will (a question also brought up in the first film) you balked. What do you want out of the films? Oh well, its a bummer you didn't like it, but while reserving judgment completely until the trilogy is complete, I would suggest these are the best sci fi movies since the OT. :cool:

mrmiller

05-19-2003, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by JON9000
while reserving judgment completely until the trilogy is complete, I would suggest these are the best sci fi movies since the OT. :cool:

I agree, mainly beacuse these are true Science Fiction movies, and not just futuristic action movies. The discussions we are having about the meaning and undertones is what make a great science fiction movie. Not just the crazy stunts and action sequences (which are nice too.) I think the review in my local newspaper summed it up best, "Imagine being buckled into a first class roller coaster and having intense cosmic discussions with a best friend/spirtual advisor between the white knuckle swoops and dives."

=MATT=

RooJay

05-19-2003, 02:59 PM

I have a feeling the Architect was lying to Neo in an attempt to convince him to give up his cause. I think it was true that they did discover an anomaly in the Matrix, and that the anomaly has been Neo from the start. I believe he actually possesses superhuman abilities of some kind in the real world, and that the machines discovered this and realized that they had a major problem on their hands. I imagine that the machines are now running scared because of this and are desperatley attempting to find a solution to their unforseen problem. I'm not even certain that any can stop the machines from within the Matrix (the existence of 'backdoors' and separate programs within and outside of the Matrix could be seen as support for this) even if they managed to take down the Matrix, the machines in the real world will still exist (For those keeping score, we are supposed to see a huge battle in the real world in the next movie). The Wachowskis have stated from the beginning that their goal was to make the coolest comic book superhero movie...as opposed to a more straightforward sci-fi (Twilight Zone style, if you will, which is pretty much what this will end up being if it turns out that there is a "Matrix within the Matrix"). I think it will become clear that there is a lot more to the notion this film brings up regarding the nature of man's symbiotic relationship with machines (as discussed between Neo and Councillor Hamann), and that mankind will learn a valuable lesson at the end of the story when they discover their own level of responsibilty in the events leading to their own subjugation and the creation of the Matrix (man, what a mouthful!). For those of you who have watched certain Animatrix episodes, you may recall that artifically intelligent machines started out as being very beneficient and peaceful and that it was humanities persecution of the machines that eventually led them to rebel and succeed in conquering and enslaving the human race. The machines originally only did what they had to to survive (remember, it was we who scorched the sky. The machines only enslaved us and turned us into living batteries after we removed their only other source of power and susteance - the sun). Two sides to every conflict...

El Chuxter

05-19-2003, 03:44 PM

So what was up with Ultra Magnus not being able to open the Matrix? Was it because Hot Rod was the chosen one and he wasn't, or because the animators didn't like Robert Stack?

And did the Matrix truly light their darkest hour? Cybertron still looked pretty dark to me.

Sorry, couldn't resist. Haven't seen Matrix 2 and don't plan on it anytime soon, or I'd contribute more.

keith koth

05-19-2003, 05:42 PM

Originally posted by RooJay
I believe he actually possesses superhuman abilities of some kind in the real world

I hope not!

The one thing that I found so fascinating about the Matrix is that it is entirely plausible...I mean...how do we know that we are not all pluged into the Matrix right now? We don't!

If Neo is given some "real world" superhuman powers (something not possible in our reality), making him significantly different from anyone else in the "desert of the real" then that totally changes my perception of the movie (but would remain consistent with the "religious" theme)...and makes me like the story less. Neo as a "super hero" in the Matrix is fine with me...but not in the "real world".

However, I am not sure I like where the movie is going if Zion is actually a Matrix w/in a Matrix (unless they find an exit from the series of Matrices by the end of Revolutions). I am so tired of movies that have ironic endings...what ever happened to the days where the good guys win and everything is resolved in the end? Now days, the irony would be in a movie that did have closure to it. Hollywood is too sequal happy...leaving everything "open-ended", so to speak, just in case it fares well at the box office...then they can make the previously unplanned sequal and profit from the original films popularity (not to imply that the Matrix sequals were not pre-planned).

IMO, the Matrix must have closure and Neo must be entirely mortal in the "desert of the real" in order for this trilogy to be great. The beauty of the Matrix movies is that one leaves the theater wondering "Am I in the Matrix?" and the feeling that you can relate to Neo and his situation (i.e. an ordinary person thrust into extraordinary circumstances)

On a side note, remember in Part one...when Morpheus tells Neo about the prophecy of "The One". Morpheus says something along the lines of "..."The One" has the ability to alter the Matrix as he sees fit..."....If Neo is "The One" and he can alter the Matrix, then why doesn't he just make the Agents disappear when they come after him? If he can, will we see him do that in Revolutions?

Eternal Padawan

05-19-2003, 05:51 PM

Tha action sequences weren't new and innovative like they were in the first film. They were just loooooonnnnnggggggggeerr. Except the freeway chase. Me likey that one.

The fight with the Oracle's guard (the Jet Li character that wasn't Jet Li)? Unnecasary.

The Neo/Smith fight? Cool, except for Smith's clumsy entrance and segue into the fight. But then it wouldn't stop.

The staircase fighting? Again, it was cool, but it just kept going and going and going and going...until it became not cool.

I dunno.

Brainiak76

05-19-2003, 05:53 PM

an ending like...Neo wakes up in front of his computer with a message on the screen telling him to "follow the white rabbit"...."knock, knock".....

i dunno if id be ******** or if id be like Ooo AH!!

actually i hope there is closure and alot of our questions are answered!! I hope its one of those movies were the good guys prevail and everything is resolved in the end!!

Jedi_Master_Guyute

05-20-2003, 11:21 AM

Seems our ole' pal, Tank, is suing the matrix and the producers, yadda yadda. check it out here:

http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,11831,00.html?eol.tkr I dunno what to make of it. I need hte Oracle to tell me what the dilly is. ;)

aceguide

05-20-2003, 11:32 AM

I have found the annimosity towards this film a puzzling question. I believe a lot of the negative reaction is from people who are unable to understand some of the subtleties, and just wanted an action flick.

Does anyone have any other ideas as to why there is such dislike.

I personally felt it was an amazing movie, and that the premis and plot really developed into a complete package.

James Boba Fettfield

05-20-2003, 11:34 AM

Tank's Chong stood alongside Reeves' Neo, Carrie-Anne Moss' Trinity and Morpheus' Laurence Fishburne as the only humans to outlast, outplay and outwit their machine nemeses.

Stupid E!, who do they get to write up their articles? At least we know a little more about the Tank situation.

Patient Zero

05-20-2003, 01:13 PM

Fartrix....errrrr, ya!

So guess who was one of the agents in the first film...Stark from Farscape.

And in the second film, Braca (Scropius's henchman from Farscape) was the sleazy looking host in the restaurant.

Just stumbled across that one.

The Overlord Returns

05-20-2003, 01:34 PM

I'm going to see the Invisibles - Oops! - I mean, the Matrix tonight....so...I'll have some thoughts for y'all tommorrow ;)

vulcantouch

05-20-2003, 01:50 PM

. . .your mischaracterization of criticisms as simple "animosity". anyhoo, to help i found several (http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?GXHC_gx_session_id_=658e385b3329d3b7&pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_PrintFriendly&c=Article&cid=1052910901141&call_pageid=1022183557980) unfavorable (http://www.oneguysopinion.com/review.asp?ID=960) reviews (http://www.filmthreat.com/noah/reviews_display?Id=4542) you (http://ae.miami.com/entertainment/ui/miami/movie.html?id=95606&reviewId=12076) might (http://www.bayarea.com/mld/cctimes/entertainment/movies/5852047.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp) enjoy (http://www.laweekly.com/ink/printme.php?eid=44142) readin (http://www.filmsnobs.com/www/jimmyo/reloaded.htm) thru (http://www.gomemphis.com/mca/movie_reviews/article/0,1426,MCA_569_1964619,00.html), and see if you can honestly say None of their criticisms ring true :)
vt

aceguide

05-20-2003, 02:25 PM

Thanks for the reviews from the critics. They do an admirable job - being critical. Yes, lots of what they said rings true and I would tend to agree.

Maybe I should have been more specific. Both at the theater and around the 'ol water cooler I have found a lot of people who really HATED the film. Thier articulation of this feeling is limited, and seems to be they felt it lacked from the first movie.

Of course, it did. It's a sequel and can no loger be as original and when the first movie came out. I do believe that the complexities of the plot line lost a lot of people, and my ultimate point was that this was one reason I really liked it.

Thanks for the reviews. Similar to what I have reas on the whole.

darthvyn

05-20-2003, 07:13 PM

Originally posted by vulcantouch
. . .your mischaracterization of criticisms as simple "animosity". anyhoo, to help i found several (http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?GXHC_gx_session_id_=658e385b3329d3b7&pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_PrintFriendly&c=Article&cid=1052910901141&call_pageid=1022183557980) unfavorable (http://www.oneguysopinion.com/review.asp?ID=960) reviews (http://www.filmthreat.com/noah/reviews_display?Id=4542) you (http://ae.miami.com/entertainment/ui/miami/movie.html?id=95606&reviewId=12076) might (http://www.bayarea.com/mld/cctimes/entertainment/movies/5852047.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp) enjoy (http://www.laweekly.com/ink/printme.php?eid=44142) readin (http://www.filmsnobs.com/www/jimmyo/reloaded.htm) thru (http://www.gomemphis.com/mca/movie_reviews/article/0,1426,MCA_569_1964619,00.html), and see if you can honestly say None of their criticisms ring true :)
vt

meh.

sure i can't say NONE of their criticisms ring true. but i think a lot of them don't. what are they - film critics, or philosophy professors?

once again, i feel that they are all trying to be the first to pan the new sure-fire blockbuster. "look at me, i don't like the thing that everyone else likes... that means i have integrity..."

anyway, i guess i'm just a retard for thinking about and discussing all the "pseudo-philosophy."

but millions of elvis fans can't be wrong...

preacher

05-20-2003, 10:41 PM

I like this new Matrix movie in the same way I liked Back to the Future II. Not very much.

What was bad?

The action sequences were ho-hum. The Marial arts fights' sequences were about 5 minutes too long, and repetitive.

The philosophical discussions were intrusive. Not at all smoothly integrated into the dialogue of the characters the way it was in the first Matrix. I understood the philosophical points, but again they seemed very forced into the conversations of the characters.

The overall plot was the same as the first Matrix - with the oracle substituted for the key-master or key-man or whatever he was. There really wasn't much point with the prissy french man. The return of agent smith was lame. In the first Matrix he was a killer arch-villian and in reloaded he sucks.

I didn't see what the big deal was with the freeway chase except the "collision".

What did I like?

I enjoyed the architect's perspective on what it meant to be the one. Similar payoff to Darth Vader's revelation of being Luke's father.

I liked Zion - almost exactly the way I pictured it.

The dialogue between Neo and the Head Councilor in the industrial zone was very good. A pity the rest of the dialogue between characters - where philosophy was discussed anyhow - was so terrible. The movie suffered horribly because of it.

derek

05-21-2003, 12:00 AM

If Neo is given some "real world" superhuman powers (something not possible in our reality), making him significantly different from anyone else in the "desert of the real" then that totally changes my perception of the movie (but would remain consistent with the "religious" theme)...and makes me like the story less. Neo as a "super hero" in the Matrix is fine with me...but not in the "real world

i'm banking neo will be a real world superman/christ-like figure. his supernatural ability in the matrix is an indication he is not normal, but actually "super-normal". he is special, which is why he is able to do anything in the matrix, and hopefully this will transfer to the real world as we saw in the end.

if they have any of this "matrix in a matrix/it's all a dream/game/or neo's crazy" stuff, i will be really disapointed, as that's all been done.

what i really like is the fact that when ever a new superman movie is made, superman will look so awesome flying around!!! my favorite part was when neo flew towards the screen to save trinity in that classic superman pose with one arm out in a fist/one arm back.:)

keith koth

05-21-2003, 12:43 AM

The Overlord Returns

05-21-2003, 09:48 AM

Well....ummm...yeah......so I saw Matrix 2 last night......and umm....

I'll be back later with more concise criticisms....however....to quote Luke Skywalker:

"What a piece of junk!"

Addendum:

OK, so.......Matrix 2.....hooboy..........

Let me start by saying I quite enjoyed the first film. No, I didn't have that "shock & awe" reaction that many others did, but I found it to be a good sci fi action film that was a little more intelligent than the usual hollywood fare........

....which makes M2 such a colossal dissapointment. It has become a franchise, plain and simple. The film seemed cobbled together around each and every big action scene. It's as if the director and writer plotted out what fights they wanted, and then strung together a ridiculously thin plot in order to guide Neo and crew to the next villains on their beat down list. The fights went on far too long. The agent smith melee was one of the more tedious things I've had to sit through, and the cgi was worse than anything else I have seen in a film. The effects in M2 are as bad as everyone likes to say the effects in the Prequels are.

The ofcourse we have the ludicrous attempts to add shlock hollywood sex appeal into the Matrix franchise. We finally get to zion only to discover a race of humans that are dimwitted and will knock boots the very instant bad techno/rave/trance music starts to play......

The film could have been 2 hours long, and it would have been much better. there were so many instances of directorial wankery (neo and councillor Haman; the kiss woman!) that I found it hard to believe I was watching a film directed by the W brothers.

Then there's the "depth" of the film. The content, the bargain basement philosophy. These meandering speeches and ponderings reminded me of the kind of deep garbage my friends and I spewed over cigarettes and coffee.....when we were 15. Bad dialogue spoken by actors who clearly had NO IDEA what they were talking about. It's like watching an actor attempt Shakespeare when he has no concept of what the language means.

There are so many things wrong with this film that I won't bother getting into. Everything that happened was predictable, right down to the "revelation" that Neo can now effect machines in the real world....or....is it the real world...is it a Matrix within the Matrix? Wooo...deep stuff........

And finally, we have the "shocking" return of a "dead" character. That should get us all running right into the theatre come november....all chanting in unison..."we are here because we are supposed to be"......

RooJay

05-21-2003, 07:04 PM

Originally posted by derek
i'm banking neo will be a real world superman/christ-like figure. his supernatural ability in the matrix is an indication he is not normal, but actually "super-normal". he is special, which is why he is able to do anything in the matrix, and hopefully this will transfer to the real world as we saw in the end.

if they have any of this "matrix in a matrix/it's all a dream/game/or neo's crazy" stuff, i will be really disapointed, as that's all been done.

what i really like is the fact that when ever a new superman movie is made, superman will look so awesome flying around!!! my favorite part was when neo flew towards the screen to save trinity in that classic superman pose with one arm out in a fist/one arm back.:)

So at least someone agrees with me.:happy:

As far as why there are so many people who 'hated' this movie (and does it really matter anyway when a movie that is supposedly this 'hated' still manages to rake in millions, and most if not all of the people who 'hate' it will still show up at the theater for Matrix 3?) it pretty much all comes down to the old notion that you can't please everybody. Everyone has very personal tastes (especially film critics) and what I might find enjoyable will almost certainly not have the same effect on at least somebody else.
I think more simply it's due to the fact that so many people really dug the first one and there was almost no way the sequels could live up to the standard, and a lot of people went in with a lot of preconceived notions of what the story is really supposed to be and how things should have played out and were disappointed when things didn't match up with their expectations or understanding of what should have come next in their minds.
Personally, I loved the movie. It was everything I'd hoped for and more (though certainly not without it's shortcomings, but no film is ever perfect), and now I certainly cannot wait to see the next chapter!
I try very hard not to resent the notion that my appreciation of something that someone else dislikes somehow makes me less intelligent, discerning, and somehow just another one of the mindless masses. Honestly though, it all boils down to the fact that no ones opinions in this world are worth more than each one's own.

Porcelina

05-22-2003, 09:54 AM

preacher and tor.... dudes said it all, so "ditto"... i'm soooo glad i went to see it on a half price tuesday and only wasted 8 bucks... however, money aside, i would still like to get that 3 hours of my life back! :mad:

evenflow

05-22-2003, 12:59 PM

I thought the movie was terrible. It was boring in pointless. X-Men 2 was a much better movie. I am so glad i went to a matinee show and did not pay full price.

Originally posted by RooJay
Does it really matter anyway when a movie that is supposedly this 'hated' still manages to rake in millions, and most if not all of the people who 'hate' it will still show up at the theater for Matrix 3?

Well, i for one will not be going to the theaters so see Matrix 3. I will wait til it comes out on video becaus eo fmy dissapointment in this one.

The Overlord Returns

05-22-2003, 01:13 PM

Well....If I don't go see it...I won't have any right to crap all over it...so, alas ...I have to see it........

Perhaps I'll sneak in to a showing ;)

Patient Zero

05-22-2003, 01:15 PM

So for those who disliked it, why? I haven't heard any actual answers just that it was 'dumb' or 'lame'. What did it have or not have that you were hoping to see? I know that the dance sceen was unnessesarily long and some of the CGI human characters were just not believable, but I don't see it as commiting any crimes that EP 1 & 2 haven't. Honestly interested.

The Overlord Returns

05-22-2003, 01:17 PM

Originally posted by The Ghost of Jonna
So for those who disliked it, why? I haven't heard any actual answers just that it was 'dumb' or 'lame'. What did it have or not have that you were hoping to see? I know that the dance sceen was unnessesarily long and some of the CGI human characters were just not believable, but I don't see it as commiting any crimes that EP 1 & 2 haven't. Honestly interested.

Just go and read my first post......I'm not going into it all again. i found it to be a poorly acted, written and directed mess. The story was unengaging, the attempts at over our head philosophy were laughable. It was a 3 hour music video.

RooJay

05-22-2003, 01:19 PM

originally posted by evenflow
Well, i for one will not be going to the theaters so see Matrix 3. I will wait til it comes out on video becaus eo fmy dissapointment in this one.

And yet by your own admission you still plan on at least renting the video. You are still contributing to the success of these films. By the way, most movies nowadays make a huge portion of their profits on the video market.

The Overlord Returns

05-22-2003, 01:22 PM

Originally posted by RooJay
And yet by your own admission you still plan on at least renting the video. You are still contributing to the success of these films. By the way, most movies nowadays make a huge portion of their profits on the video market.

This is a somewhat pointless argument. Like I said above, if one doesn't go and see the film first hand, one has no right to complain about it.

Besides, it was one bad film that followed a good one. So far their hitting par........perhaps 3 will be good.

Porcelina

05-22-2003, 02:32 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Besides, it was one bad film that followed a good one. So far their hitting par........perhaps 3 will be good.

not if that trailer at the end of the credits has anything to do with it :D

Brainiak76

05-22-2003, 03:36 PM

can you describe it?? i didnt see it.

keith koth

05-22-2003, 05:30 PM

I think that one reason for so many disappointed movie goers was the lack of explaination and incompleteness of the story. Movie goers were left wondering too many things.

The first film was pretty much self contained...meaning that it had all of the elements necessary for one to fully comprehend the point and direction of the movie. If left as is (no part II or III), Matrix I would have been just fine as a great sci-fi movie. I think most people were expecting the same type of movie again For Matrix II.

However, it was explained by the producers and directors that although the first Matrix was a completely self contained movie, it's purpose was to set up the scenario for the second two movies (the beef of the story). They went further to explain that you could consider Matrix II & III as one movie...mening that one must see both parts in order for the movie to have the completeness of Matrix I. That is the reason they are releasing the 2 movies so close to eachother.

I'm sure that after viewing Matrix III and getting the rest of the story most of the naysayers will be back on the bandwagon. Except those that thought the acting and special effects were lame...but you can't please everyone all of the time...so oh well!

RooJay

05-22-2003, 06:59 PM

I'd tend to agree with that assessment. This movie, out of all other sequels that have come down the pike, is most definitely a middle chapter in a much larger story, and probably suffers a bit moreso because. Extra good that we don't have to wait very long at all for the next chapter.

By the way, who else is playing the game? It's awesome!

Porcelina

05-22-2003, 11:04 PM

a movie should always be self-contained... same with a book... but i didn't feel the problem with matrix 2 was that it was incomplete storytelling... the problem was poor storytelling... in the sense that the plot didn't drive the movie, the action sequences and special effects did... the story was pieced together to show those off (kinda like mamma mia, if you saw the musical--the plot was silly and convoluted because all they cared about was how many abba songs they could fit in)

the other problems were that the action bits that they tried so hard to show off were 1) too long, 2) too repetitive, and 3) had poor cgi

actually, the best parts for me were the good actors in the film (no, not keanu, he just stands there looking dimwitted before getting into fights)... morpheus (obviously), the french dude, as pointless as his role was, was fantastic, and the key maker was tres cool too...

the film could easily have been 1.5-2 hours and been BETTER for it.... if they had stuck to a plot... good storytelling should be as concise as possible, and not include pointless scenes just for sex appeal (read: cave rave and monica belluci kiss)

will i go see matrix 3? yes, i will... but i will definitely go on a half-price tuesday :)

Porcelina

05-22-2003, 11:16 PM

Originally posted by Brainiak76
can you describe it?? i didnt see it.

hmm.... loads of action sequences, them fighting the machines, and of course, neo in a big showdown with agent smith... that's about all i can think of... you can probably download the trailer off the net somewhere... :)

RooJay

05-23-2003, 03:17 AM

So you're saying that you didn't like the movie? Oh okay, I think we all understand what you're trying to say now!

The Overlord Returns

05-23-2003, 09:30 AM

Originally posted by RooJay
So you're saying that you didn't like the movie? Oh okay, I think we all understand what you're trying to say now!

You really should quote when speaking to someone specifically.....

Those of us who did NOT like the film were asked why......and you get snooty with us for going into that very why......

I'd also like to chime in and state that, in my opinion, M2 proves that there were no original intentions for a sequel to the first film. The plot for M2 was so scattered it seemed as if they were having one hell of a time trying to cobble together a cohesive idea for 2 more films....

scruffziller

05-23-2003, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by keith koth
I think that one reason for so many disappointed movie goers was the lack of explaination and incompleteness of the story. Movie goers were left wondering too many things.

But that for me is exaxtly why it was great. I really like having the opportunity to discuss and speculate what is going to happen, I actually like cliffhangers.
Reloaded and Revelations are really 1 movie 2 parts.

But the way I see this movie at how people are not liking it is analagous to most people not liking a food like caviar, liver, brains, etc. but others really like those foods. People found the talking long and boring but I found it intriguing and invigorating.

The Overlord Returns

05-23-2003, 09:35 AM

Porcelina

05-23-2003, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by scruffziller
People found the talking long and boring but I found it intriguing and invigorating.

what talking? oohhhh, you mean the grade nine "philosophizing" that was interspersed during the action sequences.... :p

keith koth

05-23-2003, 01:31 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
I'd also like to chime in and state that, in my opinion, M2 proves that there were no original intentions for a sequel to the first film. The plot for M2 was so scattered it seemed as if they were having one hell of a time trying to cobble together a cohesive idea for 2 more films....

Well, then your opinion is wrong . The Wachowski brothers took the idea of the Matrix to Warner Brothers with the Specific Intention of producing the story in a trilogy format. That fact was established well before the first Matrix was ever released in theaters.

Originally posted by scruffziller
But that for me is exaxtly why it was great. I really like having the opportunity to discuss and speculate what is going to happen, I actually like cliffhangers. Reloaded and Revelations are really 1 movie 2 parts

Yes, it is fun to speculate...and I enjoyed the film for that reason as well...but many people felt disappointed because they only got half a movie.

The Overlord Returns

05-23-2003, 01:41 PM

Originally posted by keith koth
Well, then your opinion is wrong . The Wachowski brothers took the idea of the Matrix to Warner Brothers with the Specific Intention of producing the story in a trilogy format. That fact was established well before the first Matrix was ever released in theaters.

Do you have some sort of documentation on this? Or are you going by interviews that the brothers have done. If so, I'll stick by my opinion. If there was some official press release stating that it was intended to be a trilogy all along, I will concede the point.

scruffziller

05-23-2003, 01:52 PM

Originally posted by keith koth
but many people felt disappointed because they only got half a movie.

It is funny that u mention that too, I know some people that actually hate ESB for that reason and will actually never watch it again because it was a cliffhanger. I told him, "dude, then you are not a true SW fan if you think ESB was a bad movie for that reason." How can the very end of a movie ruin the whole rest of it I will never know.

keith koth

05-23-2003, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Do you have some sort of documentation on this? Or are you going by interviews that the brothers have done. If so, I'll stick by my opinion. If there was some official press release stating that it was intended to be a trilogy all along, I will concede the point.

I believe, although I may be wrong, that the idea of a trilogy was mentioned in some footage on the DVD Matrix Revisited. I believe they discussed (in some footage of the previsualization phase) exactly what elements they were looking for in their Trilogy.

Besides, all of the actors and everyone else involved in this project claim that this has been a trilogy from the beginning...even the dude that played Tank (who got shafted and was not allowed to be in Matrix II) says that it was a planed trilogy. The end of Matrix I even suggests that there would be a sequal to follow. Come on now, just because you didn't like the movie doesn't mean that you need to go around blindly :cool: throwing out accusations about the Matrix being another one of those "Hollywood" situations where they say "Hey, lets cash in on this blockbuster with a sequal or two."

If the Matrix was not planned as a trilogy from the beginning, then I'm sure we would have heard others (especially movie critics) discuss the fact that Matrix II was sequal based upon the original movie. Pretty much everyone in the entertainment industry accepts as fact that these films were planned as a trilogy.

No documentation needed for me! :D

Pendo

05-24-2003, 06:16 AM

Saw Matrix Reloaded last night, and what can I say? I LOVED it :D. I thought the story was quite good, and IMO not that confusing, I understoon everything up until Neo saw the Architect. The action scenes were extreemly cool (although the CGI looked crap), and that car/bike chase took my breath away.

The film wasn't better than the 1st, but I thought it was a close competitor. Now just gotta wait a few months for Revolutions :).

PENDO!

scruffziller

05-24-2003, 09:46 AM

Originally posted by Pendo
(although the CGI looked crap)

PENDO!

I thought the CGI was better than our SW but not as good as LOTR:TT.

I like RELOADED better than the first. The first was just eye candy and more down the road of science fantasy like SW. Where Reloaded is more down the road of science fiction like Star Trek. And with that said I am more of s Star Trek guy than a SW guy.

RooJay

05-24-2003, 04:11 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
You really should quote when speaking to someone specifically.....

Sorry, I must have been absent the day that new rule was put into effect. My post directly followed the post I was referring to so there should've been no need to quote. In the future I will do my best to meet this request of yours. M'kay? ;)

Those of us who did NOT like the film were asked why......and you get snooty with us for going into that very why......

Who's getting "snooty"? I was merely reinforcing my understanding of the opinions posted by others, and perhaps hinting that we have acknowleged and might to move on.

I'd also like to chime in and state that, in my opinion, M2 proves that there were no original intentions for a sequel to the first film. The plot for M2 was so scattered it seemed as if they were having one hell of a time trying to cobble together a cohesive idea for 2 more films....

You did see the first Matrix, right? You didn't feel there was definitelt an intent to continue that story? As I recall, that move was left pretty open ended itself with a lot of questions left to be answered and a lot of plot to resolve.

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
I found it childish and pretentious, myself.

We didn't.

Porcelina

05-25-2003, 11:34 AM

Originally posted by RooJay
So you're saying that you didn't like the movie? Oh okay, I think we all understand what you're trying to say now!

my deepest apologies, i was under the impression that this was a discussion board where people could talk about their thoughts and opinions with each other, but next time i will merely state "I did not like it!!" and you can say "I did like it!!" and then we can move onto another topic :rolleyes:

sarcasm aside, i didn't notice you being snooty to people who went into detail about why they *liked* the movie, even if the posts were getting repetitive.. and as overlord mentioned, we were ASKED to explain our reasons for not liking the movie... and considering *some* people were presuming to know exactly why we all hated the movie, i thought it would be best to clarify my point of view since i hadn't actually explained it before

and, as a side note, if you ever want to have a serious discussion with me, kill the snarky, patronizing tone please :)

scruffziller

05-25-2003, 11:53 AM

Originally posted by scruffziller

But the way I see this movie at how people are not liking it is analagous to most people not liking a food like caviar, liver, brains, etc. but others really like those foods. People found the talking long and boring but I found it intriguing and invigorating.

With saying this I'll say that the basic outline of the nature of M2 is also analagous to forms of media such as Shakespearean plays, operas, poetry, college level reading etc.. Like these, M2 would only be liked by people with aquired taste.

Porcelina

05-26-2003, 01:20 AM

Originally posted by scruffziller
With saying this I'll say that the basic outline of the nature of M2 is also analagous to forms of media such as Shakespearean plays, operas, poetry, college level reading etc.. Like these, M2 would only be liked by people with aquired taste.

i don't mean this to sound condescending, so please don't take it as such, but... what do you find so deep/thought-provoking about M2?

scruffziller

05-26-2003, 08:13 AM

Originally posted by Porcelina
i don't mean this to sound condescending, so please don't take it as such, but... what do you find so deep/thought-provoking about M2?

The deep mystery of what is actually going on here in the matrix.
My friend and I stood out in the parking lot of the movie theatre discussing for 2 hours what Revalations is going to show us.
As hard as they have worked to becoming free, I believe they have not actually left the matrix and how will we really know if they will ever really will leave?? My brain is arack with possibilities
and it is about to overload!!!!!:crazed:

The Overlord Returns

05-26-2003, 10:27 AM

Originally posted by RooJay

You did see the first Matrix, right? You didn't feel there was definitelt an intent to continue that story? As I recall, that move was left pretty open ended itself with a lot of questions left to be answered and a lot of plot to resolve.

Sure, they left the ending somewhat open ended, no doubt in the hopes that it would be successful enough to warrant a sequel. However, it's a poor filmmaking choice to have your hero become uber powerful at the end of the first act. Imagine how dull ESB and ROTJ would have been if Luke had become as powerful as yoda at the end of ANH.

mini-rock

05-26-2003, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Imagine how dull ESB and ROTJ would have been if Luke had become as powerful as yoda at the end of ANH.

That would have made the films better IMO, instead of Luke being such a wuss.

Anakin2121

05-26-2003, 11:20 PM

Originally posted by mini-rock
That would have made the films better IMO, instead of Luke being such a wuss.

Exactly!!! :D

Besides, so what? The Matrix #1 can function as a standalone film and the first act of a trilogy. So what? It's the same with the Star Wars films. You could watch ANH by itself and be satisfied because it has its own story, but also sows the seeds for the setup of its sequels. It's the same with the Matrix series.

On its own the Matrix Reloaded is definitely a weak film, but as a sequel to the first movie, or better yet as the middle film of the trilogy, it's a freakin' awesome movie!!! :D

The rabid fanboys are all the same. They were just like this at the release of TPM. So much anticipation, so much hype....no movie, not even the greatest friggin' masterpiece ever conceived, can ever be all things to all people and please everyone (which Lucas is trying to do with the prequels), and the fanboys have such ludicrous expectations for the film that no movie could ever truly deliver, and so upon the movie's release they promptly begin trashing the film. :(

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 09:25 AM

Originally posted by mini-rock
That would have made the films better IMO, instead of Luke being such a wuss.

Ah yes, because the fight in ESB would be yards better with Luke spanking down Vader yoda style....that would have been great drama :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Anakin2121

The rabid fanboys are all the same. They were just like this at the release of TPM. So much anticipation, so much hype....no movie, not even the greatest friggin' masterpiece ever conceived, can ever be all things to all people and please everyone (which Lucas is trying to do with the prequels), and the fanboys have such ludicrous expectations for the film that no movie could ever truly deliver, and so upon the movie's release they promptly begin trashing the film. :(

Erm........

I am hardly a rabid fanboy when it comes to tha Matrix series. As stated earlier, I enjoyed the first film, but didn't love it. M2 is a poorly crafted mess, IMO. Why is it so hard for those who liked it to accept that there are concrete reasons to NOT like the film as well?

scruffziller

05-27-2003, 09:43 AM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Why is it so hard for those who liked it to accept that there are concrete reasons to NOT like the film as well?

I am not touching that with a 10 foot pole. :rolleyes:

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 09:47 AM

Originally posted by scruffziller
I am not touching that with a 10 foot pole. :rolleyes:

LOL....and why is that, may I ask?

........Since you clearly wanted to show how much you dissaprove of the remark ;)

scruffziller

05-27-2003, 10:43 AM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
LOL....and why is that, may I ask?

........Since you clearly wanted to show how much you dissaprove of the remark ;)

Who said anything about dissaproving????

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns

Why is it so hard for those who liked it to accept that there are concrete reasons to NOT like the film as well?

And vice versa. But I haven't seen that happening.

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by scruffziller
Who said anything about dissaproving????

It was clear enough in the tone of your post......

Seriously though, what about that statement causes you to roll the eyes?

scruffziller

05-27-2003, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
It was clear enough in the tone of your post......

Seriously though, what about that statement causes you to roll the eyes?

A snicker.:crazed:

Patient Zero

05-27-2003, 11:18 AM

What I want to know is why people bother to waste their time and energy bashing things in an attempt to change other's opinions? And yes, that is what is happening or else one would just state their opinion and move on. Matrix 2 I liked very much, but I don't feel the need to convince others of its cinematic or philisophical value. If you don't like it then you don't; no skin off my back. Xmen 2 I thought was a complete waste, but I am not over in that thread bashing it because I don't care if others liked it. To each his own.

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by The Ghost of Jonna
What I want to know is why people bother to waste their time and energy bashing things in an attempt to change other's opinions? And yes, that is what is happening or else one would just state their opinion and move on. Matrix 2 I liked very much, but I don't feel the need to convince others of its cinematic or philisophical value. If you don't like it then you don't; no skin off my back. Xmen 2 I thought was a complete waste, but I am not over in that thread bashing it because I don't care if others liked it. To each his own.

Wasn't it you that asked for reasons as to why we didn't like it?

Besides, I thought the thread title here was Matrix Reloaded "Discussion".....

James Boba Fettfield

05-27-2003, 11:45 AM

It is a discussion, I used my moderator super powers to call it that. So let it be written, so let it be done. Now back to discussing, like we've been doing all along.

RooJay

05-27-2003, 12:44 PM

Originally posted by Porcelina
my deepest apologies, i was under the impression that this was a discussion board where people could talk about their thoughts and opinions with each other, but next time i will merely state "I did not like it!!" and you can say "I did like it!!" and then we can move onto another topic :rolleyes:

I never once stated that you were not allowed to express your opinions. I dare you to find one instance of me doing this. As far as I'm concerned, you can feel free to hate anything you want; I couldn't really care less. The point I was trying to make was that your point was already made and is now well understood by all involved. :D It just seemed to me that anytime someone chimed in about how much they enjoyed the movie, either you or the other guy decided to beat us over the head again (and seemingly insult the intelligence of everyone who disagrees) about how much you disliked it. I just didn't feel that you had added anything new to the discussion in a long time, but by all means - Preach on! ;) I've come to accept and appreciate being educated on how I have no taste in entertainment, no understanding of 'true' philosophy and how I was maliciously fooled into thinking I had actually enjoyed the Matrix sequel. :rolleyes:

sarcasm aside, i didn't notice you being snooty to people who went into detail about why they *liked* the movie, even if the posts were getting repetitive..

Why would anyone ever do that? I didn't get "snooty" with them because they shared my views. To do otherwise is quite pointless. Besides, I have yet to notice anyone getting repetitive about how much fun they had; although again, that probably has lots to do with the fact that I tend to agree with them. :sur:

and, as a side note, if you ever want to have a serious discussion with me, kill the snarky, patronizing tone please :)

Duly noted.:)

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Sure, they left the ending somewhat open ended, no doubt in the hopes that it would be successful enough to warrant a sequel. However, it's a poor filmmaking choice to have your hero become uber powerful at the end of the first act. Imagine how dull ESB and ROTJ would have been if Luke had become as powerful as yoda at the end of ANH.

So am I correct in assuming that you weren't terribly pleased with the first Matrix either? Seems to me as though you would have had the same problems with that one as well, correct?

Originally posted by The Ghost of Jonna
What I want to know is why people bother to waste their time and energy bashing things in an attempt to change other's opinions? And yes, that is what is happening or else one would just state their opinion and move on. Matrix 2 I liked very much, but I don't feel the need to convince others of its cinematic or philisophical value. If you don't like it then you don't; no skin off my back. Xmen 2 I thought was a complete waste, but I am not over in that thread bashing it because I don't care if others liked it. To each his own.

EXACTLY ! (except for that stuff about X2!)
It should go without saying that I couldn't really care less if someone else doesn't like the same things as I, but it does seem as though this exact thing of which you speak happens quite a lot around here. Perhaps, too many people spending too much time telling us how we're all wrong for enjoying something just because they themselves don't?

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 12:55 PM

Originally posted by RooJay
So am I correct in assuming that you weren't terribly pleased with the first Matrix either? Seems to me as though you would have had the same problems with that one as well, correct?

If you go back and actually read my previous posts you'll see that I enjoyed the first Matrix film, just didn't "love" it or consider it a groundbreaking masterpiece.

As for the problems in M2, no I did not feel them as acutely in the first film. The dialogue was better, the plot was far more structured. In the Matrix, the action sequences serviced the story, whereas, in Matrix 2, the story seemed to be less important than the next big boffo action scene featuring an overpowered Neo facing threats he would easily dispatch. There was never once the slightest bit of worry that he was in danger, that he might lose. As for the philosophy, again in the first film, it was put forth in a more cohesive way, and never fell into the realm of pretention that I feel the nauseating platitudes did in M2.

The major problem I had with the first film has been illustrated in my previous posts. If they knew a trilogy was in the works, they made a bad judgement call in making Neo so powerful by the end of the film.

Originally posted by RooJay

EXACTLY ! (except for that stuff about X2!)
It should go without saying that I couldn't really care less if someone else doesn't like the same things as I, but it does seem as though this exact thing of which you speak happens quite a lot around here. Perhaps, too many people spending too much time telling us how we're all wrong for enjoying something just because they themselves don't?

PLease tell me where in this thread I stated that anyone who enjoyed M2 were "wrong" for doing so, simply because I did not.

Porcelina

05-27-2003, 01:13 PM

Originally posted by RooJay
I never once stated that you were not allowed to express your opinions.

true, it was never stated, it was merely implied in a sarcastic whiny tone

Originally posted by RooJay

The point I was trying to make was that your point was already made and is now well understood by all involved.

my point??? already made??? but... umm.... it was the first time i'd explained my point of view....

Originally posted by RooJay

I've come to accept and appreciate being educated on how I have no taste in entertainment, no understanding of 'true' philosophy and how I was maliciously fooled into thinking I had actually enjoyed the Matrix sequel.

glad you're finally coming to your senses :D

Originally posted by RooJay

Why would anyone ever do that? I didn't get "snooty" with them because they shared my views.

ahh... i see... you only like to listen to people who have the same views as you... makes for some very interesting conversation, i'm sure :rolleyes:

James Boba Fettfield

05-27-2003, 01:24 PM

Ok, I think I got this thread organized. I've noticed quite a bit of back to back posting. Please avoid that, just use the edit button.

RooJay

05-27-2003, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by Porcelina
ahh... i see... you only like to listen to people who have the same views as you... makes for some very interesting conversation, i'm sure :rolleyes:

Naturally, but of course you realize that I did in fact listen to your views. Indeed, that was my whole point; you'd already contributed your views, and we all read them.

Getting back on topic...
Is anyone playing the game? I'm not sure I saw any replies to that one.
Pretty fun, and some pretty cool story stuff to boot! I've managed to complete it with Ghost on easy mode; Niobe's next, then I'll work on up to hard. It would've been nice to be able to actaully fight the twins rather than just shoot at them from the car, but it was great to get a chance to square off against Trinity in the training program! It was also pretty cool to mix it up with Merovingian's vampire thugs too! We didn't really get a good sense of them in the movie.
If anyone's interested in spoilers from the game I'd be happy to oblige.

Patient Zero

05-27-2003, 02:10 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Wasn't it you that asked for reasons as to why we didn't like it?

Of course and those reasons were, to my knowledge, stated. I just don't see the point of beating a dead horse. But that is only my opinion. :D

mini-rock

05-27-2003, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Ah yes, because the fight in ESB would be yards better with Luke spanking down Vader yoda style....that would have been great drama :rolleyes:

LMAO! Dude! What's up with the :rolleyes:? You asked the question, and I gave an answer, and now your beating me down for it? Don't get bent b/c of an answer to a question that YOU asked is unfavorable.

And who knows how much more dramatic the fight in ESB would have been if Luke had been a full fledged Jedi. All I'm saying is IMO it would have been better.

Back to the Matrix Reloaded, my kids also thought it was great (as good as the first) and we are going tonight to see it again.:D

RooJay, yeah I'm playing the game. There's been some discussion on it in the video games section.:D

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by mini-rock
LMAO! Dude! What's up with the :rolleyes:? You asked the question, and I gave an answer, and now your beating me down for it? Don't get bent b/c of an answer to a question that YOU asked is unfavorable.

Jeez...don't get excited. The :rolleyes: in the post was merely to indicate the overall sarcastic tone........no one is "beating you down".

mini-rock

05-27-2003, 02:47 PM

Originally posted by The Overlord Returns
Jeez...don't get excited. The :rolleyes: in the post was merely to indicate the overall sarcastic tone........no one is "beating you down".

OK my bad. Yeah I think I'am a little "excited". I took my Hydroxycut to go to the gym and unfortunately my wife got called into work for a few minutes so I didn't get a chance to go yet. Now I'm sitting here all AMPED UP!! Anyway, my apologies TOR.:D

The Overlord Returns

05-27-2003, 03:25 PM

Originally posted by mini-rock
OK my bad. Yeah I think I'am a little "excited". I took my Hydroxycut to go to the gym and unfortunately my wife got called into work for a few minutes so I didn't get a chance to go yet. Now I'm sitting here all AMPED UP!! Anyway, my apologies TOR.:D

Hey, no worries. I think a few of us have gotten "excited" in this thread, myself included.

Then again, maybe we're all here doing this, because we are all supposed to be here doing this. It's all about control, and even though we think we are making a choice, perhaps that choice is just.....oh....never mind ;)

2-1B

05-28-2003, 02:41 AM

I saw this movie on Monday and wasn't very impressed.
I agree overall with some of the opinions here that it was rather boring in some respects. No, it's not because I don't "get it" -- I just didn't care much about it. Morpheus giving that speech in Zion was ridiculous.
I liked the first one and think the sequel is not as good. A small dose of Joey Pants might have helped. ;)

There was plenty to like about it, don't get me wrong. Hugo Weaving was wonderful and I could have used more of him.
Keanu was alright except for those *** cheek shots. Carrie-Anne was cool but she's looking a bit long in the tooth. :D Morpheus, well I made the Zion speech comment earlier . . . I thought he rocked in the first movie but he was somewhat bothersome in this one.

Those twins were pointless, I didn't care about them at all.

RooJay

05-28-2003, 03:40 AM

It goes wihtout saying that most films would benefit from a little dose of Joey Pants.

scruffziller

05-28-2003, 08:29 AM

On the non intellectual side. I watched The first one yesterday and realized Reloaded had tons more action sequences and tons more intensity in those sequences.

Eternal Padawan

05-29-2003, 03:25 PM

Can anyone tell me why Morpheus' "Residual Self Image" in the Matrix packed on about twenty pounds of pure belly?

I mean sure, out in the 'desert of the real' he's all about the chicken wings obviously. But why wouldn't he see himself sleek and sveldt in the computer? Instead he's all MOREpheus. I thought the Residual Self Image was gonna keel over from clogged arteries.

RooJay

05-29-2003, 03:40 PM

ROFLMAO!

Perhaps he's got a failing self image? Not feeling so confident as anymore? Might also explain why some people tend to look just as old in the Matrix as they do out, rather than everyone looking like teenagers or all in their earlt twenties when they're jacked in.

Now that I think of it, it was stated that he'd somewhat recently lost Niobe's attentions to the more 'powerful' Commander Lock. Maybe that caused him to start doubting his physical 'appeal'.

mm74md

06-01-2003, 02:31 PM

I finally got to see it last night. My wife and I thought it was great. So did the others in the audience. The Zion party was quite erotic :happy: !

It's rare for me to see a movie in the theater these days and even more rare that a movie gets applause at the end. The only other time I've experienced that was at the midnight viewings of EP1 & EP2 with other die hard SW fans and again last night with Reloaded.

I think that a lot of people don't get the point that this is only 1/2 a movie with the other 1/2 coming in November. And I can't believe the complaints about the fight scenes. What was long about them? Do you want to see Neo kick 6 butts in 1 minute? Where is the fun in that? I thought the whole Agent Smith thing was cool.

I think another issue that some people have and won't admit is the popularity of the film series now. The first Matrix was a "cult classic" and now Reloaded is a "sellout" and now is not "cool". People who blast a movie for this reason need to grow up and/or get laid without paying for it.

Finally, the issue of people who "Get It" or "Don't Get It". I'll admit that I Don't Get It with Reloaded....yet. This was the same for